The Great American Bash: Best Moments, History of the Event

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[SPEAKER_06]: Oh no!

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[SPEAKER_00]: Oh yeah!

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[SPEAKER_06]: I've finished these days.

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[SPEAKER_06]: You've earned a little enough!

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[SPEAKER_06]: Top rope nation!

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[SPEAKER_06]: Learn to have it!

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[SPEAKER_06]: It's the best thing going to settle!

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[SPEAKER_00]: What's going on everyone?

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[SPEAKER_00]: It is episode two, thirteen of top rope nation.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to be getting historical on you today.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're talking, you know, patriotism is in the air.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's a holiday weekend here in the United States.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Happy early Independence Day to all of you out there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're talking great American bash.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It makes sense if it's the theme.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Got a great guest on the line.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to be talking about

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[SPEAKER_00]: some of his work as a historian of professional wrestling and then getting him involved in this discussion of the greatest great American bash matches of all time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We're sticking to the early great American bash, the original by the way, we're not talking about the WWE or the NXT reincarnations, but yeah, I gotta go to the practice.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Just as like that's all I've prepared for a man to thousands.

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[SPEAKER_05]: Justin had a winning ramp where he was going to convince us all that changing the name to the bash was the best thing that ever happened.

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[SPEAKER_05]: The great American part is what killed those shows in O'Ford, but.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Enjoy your afternoon, Justin.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We'll see you next week.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But no, I got Kyle Ross on the line.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Justin joint as always here to break it all down.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And the very special guest, if you're a big time fan of professional wrestling, if you have been on the internet for any period of time, you are probably

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[SPEAKER_00]: familiar with his work.

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[SPEAKER_00]: His name is Graham Koth and he is the founder of the history of WWE.com.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We've referenced this website many, many times here on top of Up Nation.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's a great resource.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you're looking for any, you know, untold tidbits about how shows, if you're looking for television results, paperview results, I remember the first time I went to that site trying to find the first wrestling event I ever went to a how show in the middle of Iowa in the nineteen eighties with only a few thousand people there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: There it was, found the results.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It always wondered about it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Graham had the results.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And also, I should say, Graham, we have been friends for a long, long time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Somewhere around twenty years.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I was, I was trying last night to think, where did I meet Graham Coffin?

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[SPEAKER_00]: And it was either through WrestleView.com.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We were both involved in the early days around two thousand one-ish of rest of you.com with Adam Martin and Paul Nemer.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But I think we might have actually met before that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Or you maybe on the the Brett Hart forums back on Brett Hart.com.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I know that's where I met Paul Nemer, the founder of Russellview.com.

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[SPEAKER_04]: But I have no memory of that, but that sounds exactly like somewhere I would be.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And that's time for you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I like to say it's been two decades.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We have been friends for a long, long time.

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[SPEAKER_00]: It's about time we do a podcast together.

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[SPEAKER_04]: This is the first time you've ever actually wanted to talk to me.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Fine.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Well, I guess it's time to break the ice here.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: No, we've bonded.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, over pro wrestling, and then our love for Bruce Springsteen over the years talking about going into some concerts of the boss.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So it's great to have you on top of our nation.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And welcome to the show.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I am so happy to be here.

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[SPEAKER_04]: It's a

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[SPEAKER_04]: perfect Saturday afternoon.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I'm sorry.

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[SPEAKER_04]: No, we're listening to this in the future.

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[SPEAKER_04]: It's a perfect day to talk old school wrestling, which is one of my favorite hobbies.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Graham.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He's got the theme down, man.

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[SPEAKER_00]: He is in his wrestling room.

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[SPEAKER_00]: You see the vintage posters behind him if you're watching on YouTube.

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[SPEAKER_00]: If you're listening on the podcast and feeds, check out the YouTube video so you can see that beauty.

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[SPEAKER_00]: That wall is amazing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Love to see that here.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now, Graham, one of the things we like to do when we have people on the show for the first time is kind of just ask them, you know, what's your background story as far as how did you become a pro wrestling fan?

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[SPEAKER_00]: What are your earliest memories of watching this crazy sport?

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[SPEAKER_04]: My earliest memories probably would be of the eighties era.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I would have family, extended family, or I would have neighbors who are watching it.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And honestly, during that time frame, you had the hoogins and the watchman's and the ultimate winners and the Andre's of the Giants.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And it was very, it actually put me off because it seemed like, oh, that's the show where everyone screams.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Like, that was my, how I took it.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And then a fast forward, a couple of years, I'm in fifth grade.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I noticed, I don't know if maybe a cartoon I was watching on Saturday morning, didn't air anymore.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So I was flipping through the channels.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I came across superstars.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I thought to myself, I'm probably not supposed to be washing this.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So let's wash this.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I gave it a shell out.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And it was fascinating.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I honestly think the first episode of wrestling that I remember washing it from beginning to end is the superstars where Papa Shango put the curse on the ultimate warrior.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And we're in the water backstage.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I always say to myself, this is so weird.

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[SPEAKER_04]: There is so much to talk about.

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[SPEAKER_04]: There is so much to follow.

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[SPEAKER_04]: There are so many personalities here.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And then just fast work a few months, which finger do I want to use this finger?

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[SPEAKER_04]: The first time I'm ninety two was the first show that I was a fan for the build of.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I'm just, there's no going back at this point.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And absolutely iconic.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now I know you moved around a lot, of course, twenty years of history.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I know a little bit about you.

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[SPEAKER_00]: And so I believe wasn't your father in the military.

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[SPEAKER_04]: He was.

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[SPEAKER_04]: We lived in West Germany during a bunch of the eighties back when West Germany was still a thing.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And I would watch the armed forces network.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And we would, uh, once we moved back to the States, fast forward a few years later, I'm a wrestling fan and I'm going through these old VHS tapes of what we recorded from television back on the online courses network.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I found that they aired superstars and Saturday nights main event overseas.

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[SPEAKER_04]: back in the mid-eighties and it just kind of added fuel to the fire of this this thing is this industry is so weird and fascinating and I need to learn more about it and how did how did they get to air that stuff overseas back in the mid-eighties when they're apparently there is a there is a more happening in the US between all the wrestling companies and the WF is going global already

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[SPEAKER_00]: Now, were you, so you were mostly a WWE fan growing up, is that correct?

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[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, because no matter where I live, I can always get it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So like me, then probably, I'm Justin talks about it.

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[SPEAKER_00]: We all kind of grew up WF first.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Kyle had a little bit more background knowledge as a younger kid of what was going on in WCW and crock up before that.

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[SPEAKER_00]: But when we get into talking about the Great American Bash, these were events for me that I watched years later for the most part.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Like the mid-nineties ones I saw live on paper view, but the old stuff I had to go back and rewatch and

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[SPEAKER_04]: rewatch again get ready for this podcast so that i'm guessing that was pretty much the same for you as well for me it was probably ninety two ninety three once wrestling grabs me i'm going to block us every weekend yeah and i'm just renting whatever it is that has wrestling on it that would be my introduction and actually i know we'll talk about it later but my god look at that wow

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[SPEAKER_00]: your original VHS.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I'm amazing.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, around that period, that's how I spent my weekends to blockbuster.

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[SPEAKER_00]: They always had a great selection.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Mostly WWF in my area, but once in a while, I could get the old, the old Crockett and WCW stuff as well.

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[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, Kyle and Justin, if you have any questions as we go, feel free to jump into.

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[SPEAKER_00]: I've got some stuff there too, but I wanted to ask you, what was the kind of the genesis for starting history of WWE?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because

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[SPEAKER_00]: there's some other sites out there now that are kind of similar in Asia to what you've done but yours was as far as I know the first I had never seen anything like that before where you just charted out the entire like years of WWF results and then you moved into other companies as well all the house show results what what made you want to start that website and become honestly one of the preeminent wrestling historians out there in my view well that was never the goal really it was a lot of

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[SPEAKER_04]: downtime, but also a lot of curiosity.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I grew up a fan during the mid-nineties, so that would be the pro wrestling illustrated heyday where every month they would have the arena result section shows from all over the world.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And there's no way that you could know that all these shows were happening all over the world unless you were subscribing to that or the observer or something to that degree.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So when I would read through the magazine, they just blew my mind

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[SPEAKER_04]: that these shows were happening almost every day of the week.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And there is no way for you to experience that unless you were there.

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[SPEAKER_04]: These more TV-tay things straight up house shows.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And so I would love to look at the pages, look at the arena results, and all it would basically say is wrestler A, B, wrestler B. And in my mind, I'm going, yeah, but how?

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[SPEAKER_04]: I need more, I need more.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Like was this a thirty second match?

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[SPEAKER_04]: Was this an hour long match?

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[SPEAKER_04]: So I always wanted to be able to convey the story of the match and as much brevity as possible.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So around two thousand one, maybe it's early two thousand two, I was working full time, I took a year off college.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And so I just kind of like as my own little pet project, you know, what was happening?

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[SPEAKER_04]: the year that I became a fan.

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[SPEAKER_04]: The iconic shows that you think of when you become a fan directly as you as you're a child, what was happening the day before?

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[SPEAKER_04]: What was happening the day after?

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[SPEAKER_04]: So I kind of wanted to build that bridge and then just over time that year of Roosevelt became two years of Roosevelt.

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[SPEAKER_04]: It became ten years of Roosevelt.

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[SPEAKER_04]: It became fifteen years of Roosevelt.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And because you've

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[SPEAKER_04]: told this much story, but now kind of like if you think of it as a movie, you have a now one another prequel.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know what came before.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So like the headliner in January of this year, what was he doing in December of the year before or in July of the year before?

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[SPEAKER_04]: You know, when did he come into the territory?

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[SPEAKER_04]: So it just grew unto itself and then as it's growing, people over the world are just organically finding it.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And as they find it, they contribute.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And so it just becomes, it feeds on itself.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And that's how it's done for just, I guess, twenty years now.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Wow.

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[SPEAKER_05]: You know, obviously it's grown into something so big right now.

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[SPEAKER_05]: How many new pieces of info do you get?

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[SPEAKER_05]: per day per week per month map in twenty twenty one.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So full disclosure about a year to back.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I just decided this is too much.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So I've taken a step back.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Richard Land has has really been the driving force from the past couple years, but I will say, you know, when I was full time into it, you know, maybe I have to as an email a day, something to that degree.

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[SPEAKER_04]: But really what got me, what fueled my fire more than anything was tracking down old footage.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And this is pretty WWE network.

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[SPEAKER_04]: This is stuff that you'd never find on YouTube.

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[SPEAKER_04]: It's finding the old footage from, you know, crock it in nineteen eighty four that very few people had seen or certainly no one today really talks about and being able to add that stuff and great detail.

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[SPEAKER_04]: All right.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Because it was going to ask you about the growth of the website because I remember like I said, you were doing some self with Russell view and I remember you write in some articles on there.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Were you doing kind of like this day in history and kind of tying that into the website, something along those lines?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Had you had done much writing in the wrestling industry at all prior to launching the website?

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[SPEAKER_04]: Very little.

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[SPEAKER_04]: I think in high school, I had written for wrestling sites and then Russell view.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Full disclosure, I was going to college at that point to be a journalist, which I am today.

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[SPEAKER_04]: So yes, there is writing all along the way, but prior to launching the website, very little in the industry.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

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[SPEAKER_00]: Were there any events at all, you know, as you started going through the years, and like you said, what happened before this?

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[SPEAKER_00]: What happened before that?

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[SPEAKER_00]: Were there any events that were kind of like,

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[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know unicorns for you, where it was like very, very difficult to find out what happened, like that you were chasing down the results, anything that stands out where you just couldn't get an accurate story of what happened at some live event.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Off to the top of my head, I can't think of scenarios like that and think of our scenarios in which I find something and I basically go

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[SPEAKER_04]: Holy crap, how does not everyone know this?

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[SPEAKER_04]: This is huge.

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[SPEAKER_04]: There's something something like, and of course, I think everyone knows this at this point.

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[SPEAKER_04]: But you know, fifteen years ago, I discovered that while he was in WA World Champion, steam, the friend of the title against a guy that no one really heard of after the fact, but the guy by the name of mean mark,

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[SPEAKER_04]: And then I said, there I go.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Sting fought the Undertaker for the Indiviewa World title.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And this is, this is the dream match that everyone's talking about.

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[SPEAKER_04]: But no one really knows that that is something that actually happened.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And it headlines, I think, Greensboro and another, but

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[SPEAKER_04]: But it was only supposed to happen.

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[SPEAKER_04]: It was, I think there was an injury and they just threw in a mean mark to fill a spot.

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[SPEAKER_04]: But that kind of stuff.

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[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe someone knows shows.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And this tiny little town in the middle of nowhere gets something that means nothing at the time.

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[SPEAKER_04]: But fifteen, twenty, thirty years ago, everyone looks back and goes, that's a dream match that we didn't even know happened.

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[SPEAKER_04]: That kind of stuff.

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[SPEAKER_05]: What's the most absurd bit of info that you've come across that like just made you chuckle?

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[SPEAKER_04]: I always love coming across the shows where there's like a snowstorm and so pretty much every scheduled match can't happen because half the half the guys are stuck in airport on the other side of the country and so

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[SPEAKER_04]: The opening match with, you know, I'm just throwing out names here, but the opening match with the Brooklyn Brauler and whoever goes thirty minutes just because they're trying to kill time.

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[SPEAKER_04]: And then the main event, which is supposed to be, you know, let's say hypothetically, Hulk Hogan and Earthquake turns into some battle royal with just like the twelve guys that they could find.

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[SPEAKER_05]: I remember because I did a series and covering nineteen ninety speaking of organ earthquake recently and I used to slide a lot.

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[SPEAKER_05]: I was just combing it for like just give me some wacky stuff that happened during the dark matches or these hotchos.

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[SPEAKER_05]: And without a shadow of a doubt the best thing I learned that happened in nineteen ninety-divided F. There was a random house show in Salt Lake City, Utah.

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[SPEAKER_05]: Savage in the warrior worked.

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[SPEAKER_05]: And there were some local DJ who was doing the Reagan outs.

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[SPEAKER_05]: They're slated the DQ finish.

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[SPEAKER_05]: We're warrior got DQ and they do the thing where, you know, the announcer's supposed to say Savage wins, but he stopped the champion.

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[SPEAKER_05]: Well, this local DJ screwed up and said Savage was the new champion.

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[SPEAKER_05]: And warrior roughed him up and apparently gave him a close line and gave the guy a bloody lit.

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[SPEAKER_05]: And I'm like, this is the most amazing thing I've ever heard.

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[SPEAKER_05]: Did he go to business for himself?

16:40.212 --> 16:41.253
[SPEAKER_05]: Was that supposed to happen?

16:41.273 --> 16:47.397
[SPEAKER_05]: I just love the fact that like, yeah, the warrior's clothes lighting rate of DJs is giving a bloody lips for screwed up the announcement.

16:47.798 --> 16:52.001
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, if I'm warrior and that's fun, I might do the same thing just to get my heat back.

16:55.043 --> 16:56.584
[SPEAKER_05]: It was a cow now to my apologies.

16:56.644 --> 16:58.025
[SPEAKER_05]: I had it open there, but yeah.

16:59.445 --> 17:13.012
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I remember finding out things through your site, like, you know, I hadn't, everyone knows this now, but, you know, I didn't know Brett Hart had an Iron Man match with Rick Flair or Brett Hart had an Iron Man match with his brother Owen.

17:13.052 --> 17:16.434
[SPEAKER_00]: That stuff just blew me away when I first found out about it.

17:16.694 --> 17:25.358
[SPEAKER_04]: So just to add to that, I made the site around the same time that I discovered fancams.

17:26.979 --> 17:29.100
[SPEAKER_04]: I was a big fancam guy back in the day.

17:29.513 --> 17:34.535
[SPEAKER_04]: And those two matches you just spoke of were absolutely among my earliest fancams.

17:34.975 --> 17:43.479
[SPEAKER_04]: And I just love tracking down fancams that no one knew about adding them to the site, because you can't get more detail than actually washing the show yourself.

17:44.819 --> 17:50.322
[SPEAKER_05]: In terms of verifying that it happened, everything that goes up there is something that you had to see with your own eyes.

17:51.042 --> 17:51.582
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh no, no, no.

17:51.662 --> 17:52.082
[SPEAKER_05]: It can't be.

17:52.403 --> 17:52.743
[SPEAKER_03]: It can't be.

17:52.783 --> 17:53.303
[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

17:53.363 --> 17:53.523
[SPEAKER_03]: I mean,

17:56.834 --> 18:03.038
[SPEAKER_04]: in the sense of results that I got from magazines or, you know, to that degree, yes, I didn't see that they had that thing.

18:03.879 --> 18:06.921
[SPEAKER_04]: But I get, you know, contributions from everyone.

18:07.341 --> 18:10.424
[SPEAKER_04]: And so they're telling me based off of their own recollections.

18:11.144 --> 18:12.465
[SPEAKER_04]: Some of that's gonna be wrong.

18:13.446 --> 18:19.790
[SPEAKER_04]: But I think in the grand scheme of things, that's how, it's kind of like it, it's on Wikipedia, not everyone can make the edits.

18:20.311 --> 18:24.393
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, you have to, I would think of myself as the editor in that instance.

18:27.773 --> 18:28.794
[SPEAKER_04]: But everybody can contribute.

18:28.814 --> 18:30.595
[SPEAKER_05]: Nice.

18:31.536 --> 18:33.157
[SPEAKER_05]: There are a lot of people in Salt Lake City.

18:33.197 --> 18:33.557
[SPEAKER_05]: I know it.

18:33.657 --> 18:34.778
[SPEAKER_05]: I believe it.

18:35.218 --> 18:35.538
[SPEAKER_00]: Yes.

18:36.919 --> 18:37.380
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

18:38.020 --> 18:40.662
[SPEAKER_00]: I think too just the travel schedules too.

18:40.722 --> 18:46.686
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you always hear the old time wrestlers talking about these insane travel schedules that they had at the time.

18:46.746 --> 18:52.030
[SPEAKER_00]: And when you go through, you know, the yearly pages on your site and you kind of follow the guys around,

18:52.630 --> 18:56.232
[SPEAKER_00]: literally as you scroll down the page and you see the the way that they moved town of town.

18:56.772 --> 18:57.592
[SPEAKER_00]: It's pretty insane.

18:57.612 --> 19:06.415
[SPEAKER_00]: I mentioned I looked one of the the big unicorns for me was what was the card for the WWE F show I went to as a very very small child.

19:06.896 --> 19:08.016
[SPEAKER_00]: I have no memory of it all.

19:08.076 --> 19:20.401
[SPEAKER_00]: I just know I went to the show but it was here in my hometown and it was in July of eighty six and I found it on your site and then I wonder what was before that and I ended up finding out that the day before

19:21.242 --> 19:27.068
[SPEAKER_00]: There was a big WWF taping all-star wrestling up in Ontario.

19:27.548 --> 19:32.494
[SPEAKER_00]: So these guys worked one day in Brantford, Ontario, a television taping.

19:32.754 --> 19:34.916
[SPEAKER_00]: And the next day they were in Waterloo, Iowa.

19:35.177 --> 19:37.599
[SPEAKER_00]: And I'm thinking, how did they possibly pull that off?

19:37.659 --> 19:39.682
[SPEAKER_00]: Because the Waterloo, Iowa airport is not big.

19:40.122 --> 19:45.948
[SPEAKER_00]: How the heck in one day did these guys do a television taping an Ontario and gets a waterloo Iowa just blows me away.

19:45.969 --> 19:49.572
[SPEAKER_05]: There's a lot of that.

19:51.655 --> 19:58.883
[SPEAKER_00]: But I ended up like I never went back and looked for this because I've always looked for like photos of the show that I was at as a kid and haven't ever found a single photo of the show.

19:59.483 --> 20:04.566
[SPEAKER_00]: But I did find some of that television that was taped the day before up in Ontario, so that was kind of cool.

20:04.586 --> 20:06.548
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, track that down and have that connection.

20:06.688 --> 20:09.870
[SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, especially that eighty five to ninety stretch.

20:10.710 --> 20:12.332
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, cocaine's a hell of a drug.

20:13.493 --> 20:16.136
[SPEAKER_04]: You got a lot of people through those years.

20:16.176 --> 20:17.637
[SPEAKER_05]: Doesn't matter what the time zone is.

20:17.657 --> 20:20.840
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's for sure.

20:20.900 --> 20:21.701
[SPEAKER_05]: Let's go bar time.

20:24.864 --> 20:30.590
[SPEAKER_00]: Graham, I mentioned to you know, I was introduced to you here for the YouTube version of some people can see that the poster collection behind you.

20:30.610 --> 20:32.372
[SPEAKER_00]: That's just a fraction of what you have.

20:33.112 --> 20:35.474
[SPEAKER_00]: You've been a vendor at wrestling conventions over the years.

20:36.095 --> 20:39.618
[SPEAKER_00]: You have an absolutely insane collection of vintage wrestling posters.

20:39.658 --> 20:43.181
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes you're posting over on the Twitter feed at the history of WWE.

20:43.201 --> 20:45.363
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you have a favorite in your collection?

20:45.383 --> 20:49.546
[SPEAKER_00]: Do you have anything out there that you're looking for as far as vintage wrestling posters right now?

20:50.848 --> 20:55.992
[SPEAKER_04]: So if I look around the room and like you can see one wall, they always see a room has four walls.

20:56.012 --> 20:58.014
[SPEAKER_04]: So they're all in different walls.

20:58.694 --> 21:00.696
[SPEAKER_04]: I love, I've got to rest many five.

21:01.475 --> 21:02.656
[SPEAKER_04]: a Hogan sandwich.

21:04.016 --> 21:05.016
[SPEAKER_04]: Super colorful.

21:05.697 --> 21:07.077
[SPEAKER_04]: It's the one that looks like a painting.

21:07.917 --> 21:13.700
[SPEAKER_04]: And I've had that one signed by I'm going to ballpark here maybe fifteen twenty people that work the show.

21:14.860 --> 21:21.382
[SPEAKER_04]: So really when I look around the room, it's it's WF eighty seven to ninety three.

21:21.402 --> 21:25.144
[SPEAKER_04]: And then I've got over in in another area.

21:25.164 --> 21:28.445
[SPEAKER_04]: I've got some WSW early ninety stuff.

21:29.243 --> 21:36.246
[SPEAKER_04]: At this point, the things that I would be looking for might be, honestly, the things that we're gonna talk about today.

21:37.486 --> 21:43.689
[SPEAKER_04]: Some of that crocket mid-Adi's crocket, or some of those early WCW paper views.

21:44.289 --> 21:52.853
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know if you guys have ever seen them, but maybe during this first couple of years, they're much more of a vertical, so they're not more of a square.

21:53.453 --> 21:58.815
[SPEAKER_04]: They're like a very narrow up top, long,

21:59.955 --> 22:02.358
[SPEAKER_04]: So there's like a havoc eighty nine like that.

22:02.378 --> 22:04.500
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a bash eighty nine like that.

22:04.520 --> 22:07.163
[SPEAKER_04]: Um, turn to thank for ninety.

22:07.404 --> 22:08.745
[SPEAKER_04]: But yeah, that kind of stuff.

22:09.426 --> 22:11.528
[SPEAKER_04]: But I'll see at this point, I don't have a whole space.

22:13.110 --> 22:14.691
[SPEAKER_04]: So I need to take a step back.

22:16.439 --> 22:18.501
[SPEAKER_05]: I see the survivor series, ninety-two poster.

22:18.821 --> 22:21.703
[SPEAKER_05]: You can go out here in the corner, show your threat.

22:21.763 --> 22:22.904
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if you're aware of the screen.

22:22.924 --> 22:24.125
[SPEAKER_05]: The ultimate word and not work that show.

22:25.887 --> 22:26.187
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know.

22:26.207 --> 22:29.169
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if that added is been taken here, but it's cool.

22:29.489 --> 22:31.931
[SPEAKER_05]: I was at that show, but it's just cool.

22:31.971 --> 22:34.673
[SPEAKER_05]: You have the original poster.

22:34.854 --> 22:35.974
[SPEAKER_04]: The warrior in there.

22:36.115 --> 22:36.355
[SPEAKER_04]: Yep.

22:36.535 --> 22:38.957
[SPEAKER_04]: And that was, it's so cool that you were at that show.

22:39.037 --> 22:42.680
[SPEAKER_04]: I know it's not regarded as an all-time class or anything like that.

22:43.324 --> 22:47.587
[SPEAKER_04]: The year that you become a fan, you just remember everything in such a detail.

22:47.727 --> 22:49.829
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's, that's absolutely one of those shows for me.

22:50.349 --> 22:54.132
[SPEAKER_05]: Not to make you turn your camera, get our Bretton Shaw, even on that poster?

22:54.853 --> 22:55.013
[SPEAKER_05]: No.

22:55.433 --> 22:57.935
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah, because that wasn't a feature match originally before they made it.

22:57.975 --> 22:58.115
[SPEAKER_04]: No.

22:58.195 --> 23:04.119
[SPEAKER_04]: And of course, back then, those posters were put together so far in advance, you know, back in probably late September or so.

23:04.720 --> 23:06.501
[SPEAKER_04]: And Brett really wasn't a feature guy.

23:08.732 --> 23:12.380
[SPEAKER_00]: So one of the things that we talk about sometimes on the shows are wives.

23:12.400 --> 23:14.284
[SPEAKER_00]: And we're all married men on the show.

23:14.665 --> 23:18.954
[SPEAKER_00]: And Justin has told this funny story in the past where when he and his wife started dating.

23:19.673 --> 23:24.215
[SPEAKER_00]: He brought her in and he sat her down and he was like, Caitlin, I got something to tell you.

23:25.235 --> 23:26.455
[SPEAKER_00]: She's like, what is this going to be?

23:26.475 --> 23:28.356
[SPEAKER_00]: He's like, I'm a big pro wrestling fan.

23:28.816 --> 23:31.997
[SPEAKER_00]: So we all have stories like that.

23:32.138 --> 23:35.959
[SPEAKER_00]: So Graham, how does your wife put up with the collection?

23:36.019 --> 23:40.160
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, this super cool she has given you the wall space to have this wrestling room.

23:40.200 --> 23:47.143
[SPEAKER_00]: Obviously, you can see in my house, I've got something similar, not nearly as cool as yours, but a little wall of wrestling memorabilia.

23:47.823 --> 24:14.702
[SPEAKER_04]: what how receptive has your wife been to do in the website the collecting and all of that the she just kind of gives me my space and I give her her space to do her things but no there's there's no this is not her thing couldn't make her fan huh we she took me as we were dating she took me to a house show in the Savannah area and

24:16.471 --> 24:19.052
[SPEAKER_04]: I do remember us being in the crowd and she looks around.

24:19.092 --> 24:39.721
[SPEAKER_04]: She sees all kids having fun and and this would have been twenty sixteen and new day was there and they were huge and she I remember her turning into me and telling me okay I kind of get it now I get you know the live experience where you know I get why these I get the excitement so I'll give you that

24:41.101 --> 24:44.804
[SPEAKER_04]: but you can have your room away from everything else.

24:46.705 --> 24:47.145
[SPEAKER_00]: I love it.

24:47.665 --> 24:48.246
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, guys.

24:48.426 --> 24:52.769
[SPEAKER_00]: So before we go any further, I do want to get the usual housekeeping items out of the way.

24:52.789 --> 25:03.095
[SPEAKER_00]: Of course, if you are listening on any of the podcasting platforms, be it Apple, Spotify, Stitcher, Pod, being, we're available everywhere podcast, you're found including Amazon.

25:03.435 --> 25:06.077
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, you can get us to play on your Alexa device at home.

25:06.737 --> 25:07.918
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25:08.358 --> 25:09.379
[SPEAKER_00]: Please hit subscribe.

25:09.439 --> 25:10.659
[SPEAKER_00]: Leave us a rating and review.

25:10.719 --> 25:12.040
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25:12.060 --> 25:13.921
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25:14.722 --> 25:17.003
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25:17.143 --> 25:19.644
[SPEAKER_00]: Leave a like on this video if you enjoy what we're doing.

25:20.105 --> 25:21.225
[SPEAKER_00]: Every single show we put out.

25:21.305 --> 25:25.528
[SPEAKER_00]: We are also putting out video versions out to youtube.com slash top real nation.

25:26.108 --> 25:31.191
[SPEAKER_00]: And of course, if you want the best way to support the show, get bonus content each and every week.

25:31.711 --> 25:35.693
[SPEAKER_00]: Check out the Patreon page, the link is in the podcast and video description here.

25:36.113 --> 25:41.455
[SPEAKER_00]: We just dropped our monthly top-rope nation classics show a couple of days ago.

25:41.855 --> 25:46.157
[SPEAKER_00]: We look back at ECW one night stand, two thousand and six almost two hours.

25:46.457 --> 25:48.518
[SPEAKER_00]: Real historical deep dive on that show.

25:48.538 --> 25:49.678
[SPEAKER_00]: A lot of fun.

25:50.179 --> 25:53.500
[SPEAKER_00]: Check it out patreon.com slash top-rope nation.

26:10.503 --> 26:12.283
[SPEAKER_00]: All right, guys, let's go back in time.

26:12.303 --> 26:15.744
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's talk about the great American bash on Graham.

26:16.204 --> 26:17.805
[SPEAKER_00]: You're the historian here on the show.

26:17.845 --> 26:18.925
[SPEAKER_00]: That's what you're known for.

26:19.345 --> 26:20.385
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to throw it to you.

26:20.765 --> 26:24.626
[SPEAKER_00]: What's the genesis for the great American bash back in the mid-eighties?

26:25.867 --> 26:27.367
[SPEAKER_04]: It all surrounds dusty roads.

26:28.227 --> 26:36.549
[SPEAKER_04]: So in, you know, whether it be late, eighty-four, early, eighty-five dusty becomes full-time booker at Jim Crocker promotions.

26:37.689 --> 26:39.630
[SPEAKER_04]: And he is competing now

26:40.418 --> 26:44.061
[SPEAKER_04]: with WF who is building up to their first Rosemania.

26:45.282 --> 26:48.624
[SPEAKER_04]: And what he does essentially here, so they have StarCade.

26:48.924 --> 26:52.247
[SPEAKER_04]: StarCade is a one day event Thanksgiving.

26:53.168 --> 27:03.055
[SPEAKER_04]: Dusty is slowly not only bringing in talent and building talent to be his guys, his top heel, his top baby face, his top team, et cetera.

27:03.736 --> 27:05.357
[SPEAKER_04]: He's also laying the framework

27:05.916 --> 27:10.378
[SPEAKER_04]: for what we see in eighty six, which is essentially a major event every quarter.

27:11.558 --> 27:22.643
[SPEAKER_04]: So what we have here is an outdoor festival type atmosphere, almost a concert type atmosphere, and a little historical context here.

27:22.683 --> 27:33.267
[SPEAKER_04]: This, the first Grand Macombash in Charlotte takes place one week before live aid, which is when we think of big eighties, concert experiences,

27:34.975 --> 27:36.356
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not just wrestling.

27:37.357 --> 27:40.519
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's what we think of when we think of WrestleMania, especially the first WrestleMania.

27:40.640 --> 27:41.941
[SPEAKER_04]: It's not just wrestling.

27:41.981 --> 27:47.045
[SPEAKER_04]: There's a lot more to drive conversation in the pop culture world.

27:47.925 --> 27:49.967
[SPEAKER_04]: So does he doesn't necessarily do that?

27:50.067 --> 27:54.250
[SPEAKER_04]: He's not bringing liberal arts, he's not bringing Muhammad Ali, those kind of names.

27:54.951 --> 28:00.135
[SPEAKER_04]: But he is in the heart of the Carolina territory.

28:01.136 --> 28:03.958
[SPEAKER_04]: He is using a minor league baseball stadium.

28:04.972 --> 28:07.934
[SPEAKER_04]: He's bringing in a top-country act.

28:08.794 --> 28:17.358
[SPEAKER_04]: He is building toward a blow-off for three major fuse in the territory.

28:18.359 --> 28:28.584
[SPEAKER_04]: And if you look at the television from that time frame, you can see going back about three months how they start laying the seeds for the very recognition being the blow-off here.

28:29.425 --> 28:31.806
[SPEAKER_04]: It is a firework show.

28:31.906 --> 28:32.986
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a concert.

28:33.186 --> 28:34.047
[SPEAKER_04]: It's wrestling.

28:34.718 --> 28:37.240
[SPEAKER_04]: It's, you know, bring the kids.

28:37.500 --> 28:38.380
[SPEAKER_04]: We'll have food.

28:38.480 --> 28:47.125
[SPEAKER_04]: Like it's, it's much more than just, you know, go to the, the Greensboro Cossier from the Charlotte Cossier M and see your right player in Dusty Road, blah, blah.

28:47.626 --> 29:00.033
[SPEAKER_04]: So it very much has that patriotic family friendly live event experience, marketing around it to make it more than just a wrestling show.

29:01.942 --> 29:02.142
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

29:02.622 --> 29:04.243
[SPEAKER_00]: July, six, eight, five.

29:04.263 --> 29:13.089
[SPEAKER_00]: It was the first event as Graham said in Charlotte, headline by Tully Blanchard, defending the TV title against Dusty Rhodes in a steel cage match.

29:13.930 --> 29:14.730
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, entertainment.

29:14.750 --> 29:16.691
[SPEAKER_00]: You get that one hour David Allen Co.

29:16.811 --> 29:17.272
[SPEAKER_00]: Concert.

29:18.292 --> 29:19.333
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm the show.

29:19.673 --> 29:21.834
[SPEAKER_05]: I noticed you preface that with the word entertainment.

29:22.535 --> 29:23.275
[UNKNOWN]: Yeah.

29:23.476 --> 29:25.557
[SPEAKER_04]: I know who your audience is.

29:25.757 --> 29:26.117
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

29:26.237 --> 29:26.497
[SPEAKER_05]: I know.

29:26.537 --> 29:27.938
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, it makes sense for that.

29:27.978 --> 29:28.539
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, for sure.

29:28.579 --> 29:29.059
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm not gonna.

29:29.099 --> 29:29.299
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

29:29.639 --> 29:30.480
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm sure they loved it.

29:32.474 --> 29:34.456
[SPEAKER_00]: Now I have not seen the eighty five version.

29:34.516 --> 29:35.738
[SPEAKER_00]: So this was on close circuit.

29:35.778 --> 29:36.098
[SPEAKER_00]: Wasn't it?

29:37.199 --> 29:39.062
[SPEAKER_04]: That I'm not too sure about.

29:39.242 --> 29:39.562
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

29:39.802 --> 29:46.210
[SPEAKER_04]: It was it was among those early early VHS tapes that every store had.

29:46.730 --> 29:46.931
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

29:47.952 --> 29:51.436
[SPEAKER_00]: So like eighty five through eighty seven are not on the network.

29:52.190 --> 29:59.554
[SPEAKER_00]: But there were as you mentioned the VHS releases and you have to track them down like the first the first war games match from eighty seven.

29:59.574 --> 30:09.400
[SPEAKER_00]: I had to track that down online to watch and I don't it's been released on the WWE DVD set, but I don't have that one and it's not on the network right now.

30:09.480 --> 30:12.842
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it might have been on the previous version of the network as like a hidden gem.

30:13.462 --> 30:15.563
[SPEAKER_00]: But I couldn't find it on peacock now to rewatch it.

30:15.963 --> 30:23.464
[SPEAKER_00]: So some of those early matches from the first three years of the event are kind of elusive for fans to see at least right at this moment.

30:24.205 --> 30:28.546
[SPEAKER_00]: And you also have the fact that eighty six and eighty seven were full tours, right?

30:28.706 --> 30:40.948
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, they had like an eighty six thirteen shows around the country themed as the great American bash, but you know, one of those shows comes out as as the great American bash VHS tape.

30:41.049 --> 30:43.049
[SPEAKER_00]: Now was that a compilation or was it one of the, I'm not

30:43.289 --> 30:43.889
[SPEAKER_00]: I can't remember.

30:43.909 --> 30:45.129
[SPEAKER_04]: Or was it one or four?

30:45.369 --> 30:46.050
[SPEAKER_04]: Which year again?

30:46.210 --> 30:46.770
[SPEAKER_00]: Eighty six.

30:47.310 --> 30:48.590
[SPEAKER_04]: Eighty six is a compilation.

30:48.790 --> 30:49.430
[SPEAKER_04]: Okay.

30:50.410 --> 30:51.651
[SPEAKER_04]: That's what this is.

30:51.671 --> 30:52.551
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

30:52.911 --> 30:57.712
[SPEAKER_04]: So the major shows were Greensboro, Atlanta.

30:57.832 --> 31:00.952
[SPEAKER_04]: So basically all the big hotspots in the market territory.

31:00.972 --> 31:10.314
[SPEAKER_04]: But just just to go back a moment, they actually ran the tour, starting in Eighty six, but all the way up to eighty nine.

31:11.062 --> 31:17.546
[SPEAKER_04]: even had a tour, a ninety-one, which we don't really think about in any favorable light.

31:17.786 --> 31:19.146
[SPEAKER_04]: The ninety-one was a tour.

31:20.827 --> 31:27.511
[SPEAKER_04]: And even ninety-two had a tour where they would advertise a lot of local shows as being part of the Great and the Match tour.

31:29.152 --> 31:35.375
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, did you guys, as you were making your list of the best matches from the Great American Bachelors, anyone have anything from eighty-five on your list?

31:36.015 --> 31:38.697
[SPEAKER_00]: I did not, because I actually have not seen eighty-five footage.

31:39.837 --> 31:40.178
[SPEAKER_05]: I did not.

31:40.618 --> 31:40.858
[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

31:42.302 --> 31:43.363
[SPEAKER_04]: But eighty-five is hot.

31:43.383 --> 31:46.346
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, if you think about it over the time, eighty-five is hot.

31:46.486 --> 31:51.230
[SPEAKER_04]: They bring in the road warriors, they bring in Kamala, so it's a pretty loaded show.

31:51.651 --> 31:51.891
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

31:52.271 --> 31:58.638
[SPEAKER_05]: eighty-five and eighty-six are definitely the best years of Jim Kraken promotions for those who are looking to get into the products law.

31:59.346 --> 32:02.288
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, eighty-five on the card, I mentioned Dusty and Tully.

32:02.848 --> 32:05.229
[SPEAKER_00]: The semi-main is Flair and Nikita Coloff.

32:06.350 --> 32:07.670
[SPEAKER_00]: Magnum TA and Kamala.

32:08.131 --> 32:12.473
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the road warriors taken on a Crusher cruise ship and Ivan Coloff, the Russian team.

32:12.493 --> 32:14.894
[SPEAKER_00]: So there's big stars, especially from that era.

32:14.914 --> 32:17.676
[SPEAKER_00]: The Minnesota Reckon crew was taken on Buzz Soyer and Dix later.

32:18.196 --> 32:21.438
[SPEAKER_00]: So, yeah, a star-studded show, no doubt about it.

32:21.618 --> 32:28.001
[SPEAKER_00]: But eighty-six was the first one where, now Kyle, full disclosure, Kyle sent Justin and I list of

32:28.381 --> 32:35.746
[SPEAKER_00]: his top ten matches right off the bat, and then as I started kind of combing through the results and rewatching stuff, it largely lined up with what Kyle had sent me.

32:35.786 --> 32:38.668
[SPEAKER_00]: I think I only added one match to the list that he had sent.

32:46.839 --> 32:47.940
[SPEAKER_04]: You're gonna like it, too.

32:48.180 --> 32:48.640
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

32:49.321 --> 32:51.462
[SPEAKER_00]: But usually Kyle knows what he's talking about.

32:51.502 --> 32:53.844
[SPEAKER_00]: I call him the wrestling rainman Graham on the show.

32:53.884 --> 32:57.206
[SPEAKER_00]: He's got a great mind for the history of the business.

32:57.346 --> 33:04.671
[SPEAKER_00]: And so when he said, watch this July fifth match from nineteen eighty six between Ricky Morton, Rick Flair, Cage match.

33:05.532 --> 33:06.253
[SPEAKER_00]: I had to watch it.

33:06.833 --> 33:09.835
[SPEAKER_00]: And my God, the heat in that match is unbelievable.

33:10.095 --> 33:11.276
[SPEAKER_00]: Just a great match.

33:11.296 --> 33:12.497
[SPEAKER_00]: Did you have that one on your list, Graham?

33:13.750 --> 33:35.515
[SPEAKER_04]: actually for sake of just grabbing a handful of matches I didn't consider the tours because they're basically running the same match I mean not the same match but you would see the same match on the tour you know a dozen times so it all depends on you know whether you saw it from the home video or whether you saw it

33:36.124 --> 33:40.826
[SPEAKER_04]: from whatever footage they showed on television at the time because that was a big deal.

33:41.246 --> 33:53.051
[SPEAKER_04]: They would take long segments from the bash tour matches and put it on worldwide or put it on the Saturday night show or, you know, I'm going to be that guy.

33:53.611 --> 33:54.872
[SPEAKER_04]: I picked from the paper views.

33:56.245 --> 33:57.526
[SPEAKER_04]: primarily.

33:57.806 --> 34:02.070
[SPEAKER_05]: Did that match make the commercially released take display or Morton match?

34:02.831 --> 34:03.431
[SPEAKER_04]: No, no.

34:03.991 --> 34:07.955
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't think I saw that one until maybe one of the flare DVDs.

34:08.015 --> 34:09.356
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, the retirement.

34:09.696 --> 34:09.996
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.

34:10.297 --> 34:13.499
[SPEAKER_05]: I think it was the Rick Flare and Horseman DVD ride we talked about.

34:13.539 --> 34:15.341
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's why I watched it.

34:15.521 --> 34:17.303
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it comes in on the helicopter.

34:18.063 --> 34:18.723
[SPEAKER_00]: Pretty cool stuff.

34:18.783 --> 34:18.903
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

34:18.964 --> 34:19.204
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

34:19.784 --> 34:21.645
[SPEAKER_05]: I had never seen it before that DVD either.

34:21.685 --> 34:26.847
[SPEAKER_05]: They actually released, I believe, this full show on the network is one of the hidden gems.

34:26.887 --> 34:27.928
[SPEAKER_05]: It's no longer there.

34:28.308 --> 34:29.389
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

34:29.749 --> 34:41.214
[SPEAKER_05]: The reason I wanted to highlight this match specifically, I think when you talk about Rick Flair as a heal, there's just a lot of images that conjure up like begging off, you know, dirtiest player in the game type stuff.

34:41.234 --> 34:44.356
[SPEAKER_05]: But when I love about him working with Morton,

34:45.419 --> 34:47.701
[SPEAKER_05]: is we get to see Rick Flare as a bully.

34:48.442 --> 34:50.964
[SPEAKER_05]: What you do not see him working as, very often.

34:51.004 --> 34:53.146
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, he's on offense, he's the aggressor.

34:53.166 --> 35:00.012
[SPEAKER_05]: They had run, obviously, the big angle, you know, with Morton, you know, rubbing his nose on the ground, which is tremendous leading up to this.

35:00.292 --> 35:01.553
[SPEAKER_05]: But Flare is a bully.

35:01.593 --> 35:05.376
[SPEAKER_05]: He'll normally, it's like, you know, him chop and luger, him chop and beg it off.

35:05.457 --> 35:06.277
[SPEAKER_05]: No, no, no.

35:06.337 --> 35:07.478
[SPEAKER_05]: And he has to cheat to get the advantage.

35:07.799 --> 35:08.880
[SPEAKER_05]: This was a totally,

35:09.520 --> 35:13.882
[SPEAKER_05]: different style of work than you usually got for Rick Flair.

35:14.162 --> 35:17.463
[SPEAKER_05]: And I think that made it novel and certainly worked the watch for anyone who's ever seen it.

35:18.164 --> 35:18.384
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

35:18.744 --> 35:19.544
[SPEAKER_04]: Very good point.

35:19.644 --> 35:20.465
[SPEAKER_04]: Very good point.

35:20.865 --> 35:23.446
[SPEAKER_04]: And Flair is not thought of as the biggest guy in the world.

35:23.726 --> 35:25.087
[SPEAKER_04]: But in this case, you're right.

35:25.107 --> 35:26.867
[SPEAKER_04]: He's working against the guy who's smaller than him.

35:27.308 --> 35:28.288
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and that's what makes it work.

35:28.308 --> 35:28.668
[SPEAKER_05]: You're right.

35:28.688 --> 35:29.088
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

35:29.168 --> 35:31.049
[SPEAKER_05]: It's because the size difference warms a little guy.

35:31.089 --> 35:34.631
[SPEAKER_05]: And I mean, nobody plays the babyface in peril quite like Rick.

35:34.891 --> 35:36.312
[SPEAKER_04]: One of the best selling points about that.

35:37.842 --> 35:50.452
[SPEAKER_04]: is the fact that they, and this is how they marketed it, Ric Flair is going to have twelve thirteen different opponents during this tour, road warrior Hawk, road warrior animal, Ricky Morty, dusty roads, Ron Garvin, is he going to survive?

35:50.472 --> 35:51.893
[SPEAKER_04]: That's right.

35:51.953 --> 35:53.534
[SPEAKER_04]: You can come out of this as the champion.

35:54.175 --> 35:55.336
[SPEAKER_04]: Spoiler, he does not.

35:57.075 --> 36:00.176
[SPEAKER_05]: And that was also that complete show where he loses the title of Dusty.

36:00.376 --> 36:03.236
[SPEAKER_05]: In the case, that was the other hidden gem that they added on the network.

36:03.376 --> 36:04.656
[SPEAKER_05]: Again, not up yet.

36:04.756 --> 36:07.597
[SPEAKER_05]: But we have been promised everything since some of my summer slam.

36:08.037 --> 36:18.979
[SPEAKER_04]: So I loved one of those hidden gem, uh, bash eighty six tours because you can see Dustin Rhodes driving the guys out to the ring on the golf cart.

36:19.639 --> 36:20.739
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh, wow.

36:20.959 --> 36:21.459
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, my goodness.

36:21.499 --> 36:21.839
[SPEAKER_05]: I did that.

36:21.859 --> 36:22.199
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

36:22.699 --> 36:26.380
[SPEAKER_04]: Specifically, he's driving Ron Garvin and Wahoo McDaniel.

36:27.358 --> 36:28.799
[SPEAKER_04]: And he's got to be a team.

36:29.359 --> 36:29.639
[SPEAKER_04]: Wow.

36:30.120 --> 36:30.340
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

36:31.420 --> 36:32.621
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, worth watching for sure.

36:32.641 --> 36:36.983
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, it was on Rick Flair and the four horsemen that DVD set that came out.

36:37.463 --> 36:39.485
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, that's where to eight seven.

36:40.765 --> 36:43.987
[SPEAKER_00]: The first war games match takes place in Atlanta.

36:44.507 --> 36:45.308
[SPEAKER_00]: I watched this one.

36:45.408 --> 36:47.949
[SPEAKER_00]: I've seen it before, but not in quite some time.

36:48.009 --> 36:49.330
[SPEAKER_00]: I rewatched it last night.

36:49.790 --> 36:51.571
[SPEAKER_00]: I had to watch it off a daily motion.

36:51.791 --> 36:52.832
[SPEAKER_00]: Come on, peacock.

36:53.332 --> 36:54.572
[SPEAKER_00]: first war games match.

36:54.952 --> 37:00.834
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm watching on daily motion and I'm like screen casting it to my roco and it's so pixelated.

37:01.474 --> 37:02.714
[SPEAKER_00]: But man, what an awesome match.

37:03.314 --> 37:04.254
[SPEAKER_00]: It is an awesome match.

37:04.294 --> 37:08.415
[SPEAKER_00]: I need the better quality on peacock so I can watch it as it is meant to be seen again.

37:09.355 --> 37:11.596
[SPEAKER_00]: But you know, you got five on five.

37:11.636 --> 37:17.017
[SPEAKER_00]: You've got JJ Dylan and their factory into the finish and JJ Dylan Bleeding as well.

37:17.777 --> 37:19.737
[SPEAKER_00]: First war games match guys talk about it.

37:19.777 --> 37:20.798
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you like about it?

37:21.458 --> 37:22.258
[SPEAKER_00]: Gramps start with you.

37:23.271 --> 37:29.794
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, you really don't need anything other than a good working VCR to watch that match in full.

37:30.554 --> 37:31.054
[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.

37:31.074 --> 37:31.795
[SPEAKER_00]: You got the tape.

37:32.315 --> 37:32.895
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, I do.

37:33.395 --> 37:39.418
[SPEAKER_04]: So I know I think I think there's a large percentage of the fan base that just loves word games.

37:39.578 --> 37:40.939
[SPEAKER_04]: They love the comments out.

37:41.419 --> 37:43.160
[SPEAKER_04]: Think about all the great matches over the years.

37:43.420 --> 37:48.542
[SPEAKER_04]: But if you think back to nineteen eighty seven, it's really convoluted, right?

37:49.258 --> 37:59.002
[SPEAKER_04]: It's really, you need a stopwatch to keep up with, okay, so you can go in in one minute and you have to wait for three minutes and you have your team has it's very convoluted.

38:00.922 --> 38:12.367
[SPEAKER_04]: I think the eighties and I love if you've seen the, some of the eighties seven ants, the commercials that are trying to sell this concept.

38:12.965 --> 38:23.453
[SPEAKER_04]: And it shows all these people work, it's all these mechanics or whatever they are trying to build, this massive cage, it's really, very mad, maxish.

38:25.094 --> 38:28.517
[SPEAKER_04]: Eighty-seven is really cool for that concept.

38:28.917 --> 38:38.364
[SPEAKER_04]: I think there were certainly better, better work games matches over the years, but it's hard to beat the first one in terms of impact.

38:39.101 --> 38:42.963
[SPEAKER_00]: The VHS, you held up, too, that artwork on the cover.

38:43.363 --> 38:49.186
[SPEAKER_00]: I think isn't that the one that AEW imitated when they did the blood and guts that kind of tried to recreate that?

38:49.266 --> 38:50.686
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a pretty iconic poster.

38:50.947 --> 38:51.447
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.

38:53.248 --> 38:56.889
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, it was July fourth of eighty seven in Atlanta.

38:57.069 --> 38:59.431
[SPEAKER_00]: They did the second one in Miami just a few weeks later.

38:59.791 --> 39:00.791
[SPEAKER_00]: Almost the same line up.

39:00.831 --> 39:02.192
[SPEAKER_00]: The difference was in the first one.

39:02.652 --> 39:06.114
[SPEAKER_00]: You had JJ, of course, team in with the rest of the horsemen.

39:06.134 --> 39:08.235
[SPEAKER_00]: It's Flair, Aaron, Lex and Tully.

39:09.203 --> 39:13.345
[SPEAKER_00]: and they were taken on the road warriors, Ketakola, Dusty Rhodes, and Paul Ellering.

39:13.766 --> 39:18.328
[SPEAKER_00]: When they run it back on July, they're the first Miami, the differences instead of JJ Dillon.

39:18.628 --> 39:21.790
[SPEAKER_00]: You have the war machine that are known as the big boss man.

39:22.110 --> 39:23.771
[SPEAKER_04]: And you knew that why that is, right?

39:23.831 --> 39:24.031
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

39:24.491 --> 39:29.414
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because JJ got all sorts of aftop and I finished the first one.

39:29.614 --> 39:29.914
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

39:30.134 --> 39:31.415
[SPEAKER_00]: Pretty brutal.

39:31.435 --> 39:34.196
[SPEAKER_05]: You got they had to modify the doomsday to buy it because of the

39:35.677 --> 39:46.049
[SPEAKER_05]: low ceiling and they modified it by just killing jays for older that poor guy that it just looks rough you know I am so jealous of grandma because he's actually got

39:46.969 --> 39:49.331
[SPEAKER_05]: the, you know, the master popping of it.

39:49.411 --> 39:51.593
[SPEAKER_05]: I just have a dubbed version of it way back.

39:51.613 --> 40:03.443
[SPEAKER_05]: When I remember watching the first war games for the first time and thinking something was wrong with my TV because the crowd is so loud compared to the announcing.

40:03.703 --> 40:08.247
[SPEAKER_05]: Like I don't know if it was mixed that way or if the crowd was just that freaking insane and the omnivot.

40:08.307 --> 40:10.850
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, these people were fraught that at the mouth

40:11.410 --> 40:16.515
[SPEAKER_05]: You talk about the history of war games, and we're obviously all used to the heels getting the advantage, right?

40:16.555 --> 40:20.418
[SPEAKER_05]: It's just like old hat, because it makes sense from a psychology perspective.

40:20.438 --> 40:24.022
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, it'd be weird if the baby faces had the man advantage.

40:24.938 --> 40:32.123
[SPEAKER_05]: But in this first instance, that Omni-Cron was living and dying with every entry.

40:32.143 --> 40:35.345
[SPEAKER_05]: Like they were freaking out when the baby face would be down to one or three two.

40:35.425 --> 40:41.389
[SPEAKER_05]: And then it would be this massive relief for explosion when the baby face would even the odds up.

40:43.450 --> 40:45.672
[SPEAKER_05]: I just think in terms of the psychology of the work game's working,

40:46.945 --> 40:50.149
[SPEAKER_05]: This, you know, I don't know if it can be beat by maybe ninety two.

40:51.711 --> 40:58.320
[SPEAKER_05]: Ninety two is a better overall match than this one, but in terms of just the crowd heating them, living and dying with every entry.

41:00.442 --> 41:02.385
[SPEAKER_05]: Man, just being in that crowd that night.

41:03.872 --> 41:12.341
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, imagine being sitting next to that guy that real big, I mean, you're not supposed to say the same words, big, that large man with the Larry Bird jersey on.

41:12.441 --> 41:14.262
[SPEAKER_05]: That would have been the same.

41:14.623 --> 41:16.825
[SPEAKER_05]: If anyone see that they show, they stop on it.

41:16.845 --> 41:19.548
[SPEAKER_05]: If everyone wants to watch it, that's a rest of the fact, right?

41:19.588 --> 41:25.454
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, also a little context here in the mid-eighties Atlanta had nothing to cheer for, right?

41:25.974 --> 41:27.576
[SPEAKER_04]: The braids weren't winning any games.

41:27.952 --> 41:29.153
[SPEAKER_04]: But destiny road was.

41:29.173 --> 41:30.614
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's true.

41:30.674 --> 41:37.838
[SPEAKER_05]: And you know, the hawks that they would only make it so far and the falcon stunk, I think they had three hockey teams leave.

41:39.420 --> 41:40.161
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.

41:40.881 --> 41:41.302
[SPEAKER_00]: No, yeah.

41:41.422 --> 41:48.207
[SPEAKER_00]: This makes, I guess wrestling crowds aren't exactly like this anymore, but it definitely gets the excited to have wrestling crowds back here soon.

41:49.028 --> 41:55.613
[SPEAKER_00]: We just raved about the ECW one night stand crowd in O six and O five and how hot they were.

41:56.093 --> 41:57.895
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, you're getting crowds like that.

41:58.475 --> 42:01.498
[SPEAKER_00]: It seems like almost every night out in that era back that.

42:03.455 --> 42:04.156
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, you're right.

42:04.216 --> 42:04.556
[SPEAKER_04]: You're right.

42:04.977 --> 42:07.579
[SPEAKER_00]: Definitely stands out and stands the test of time.

42:08.019 --> 42:13.845
[SPEAKER_00]: So ADA, I should have mentioned two that they're giving these events tag lines.

42:13.865 --> 42:15.987
[SPEAKER_00]: Like ADA, they double the price for freedom.

42:16.007 --> 42:16.968
[SPEAKER_00]: AD nine.

42:16.988 --> 42:18.690
[SPEAKER_00]: We're going to get to they call it glory days.

42:18.710 --> 42:19.571
[SPEAKER_00]: Now,

42:21.752 --> 42:25.774
[SPEAKER_00]: I noted in my research that there's a really good tag team match from that year.

42:25.794 --> 42:28.676
[SPEAKER_00]: The Midnight Express defeating the fantastic.

42:28.696 --> 42:30.977
[SPEAKER_00]: That one got four stars in the observer.

42:31.037 --> 42:36.279
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't have time to go back and rewatch that, but I added it to my list to watch at some point over the weekend.

42:36.299 --> 42:38.140
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if you guys have thoughts on that match.

42:38.801 --> 42:40.542
[SPEAKER_03]: Go on, go on.

42:40.622 --> 42:43.963
[SPEAKER_04]: I was going to say the match is really good because it's the one.

42:44.043 --> 42:49.326
[SPEAKER_04]: The match is really good, but it gets talked about a lot because it does have that paper view platform.

42:50.062 --> 43:07.401
[SPEAKER_04]: If I could make another recommendation, they had a match about six weeks, two months earlier on television that went, I don't know, three minutes or four, even minutes, something that, if you can track that one down, I think you would, absolutely, I think you would prefer the earlier one.

43:09.245 --> 43:10.146
[SPEAKER_05]: That's what I was going to say.

43:11.627 --> 43:12.988
[SPEAKER_03]: I was going to talk about that.

43:13.248 --> 43:14.489
[SPEAKER_05]: That match is incredible.

43:14.509 --> 43:17.051
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, that might be the United States U.S.

43:17.111 --> 43:17.632
[SPEAKER_05]: match in the year.

43:18.232 --> 43:18.973
[SPEAKER_05]: The match you're talking about.

43:19.013 --> 43:19.693
[SPEAKER_05]: God bless it.

43:19.754 --> 43:20.534
[SPEAKER_05]: Why can't I not think of what?

43:20.734 --> 43:21.455
[SPEAKER_05]: It's a Chan and Nuga.

43:21.855 --> 43:23.076
[SPEAKER_05]: Yep.

43:23.617 --> 43:27.920
[SPEAKER_05]: It's, uh, I think in multiple parts on YouTube, so it can be found.

43:28.260 --> 43:34.105
[SPEAKER_05]: And it also, the reason that I omitted it from the list, I said, you're right, is not only is that match, but I like the clash match better.

43:34.625 --> 43:39.949
[SPEAKER_05]: to the minimum, which is the wild out-of-control role on that show.

43:39.969 --> 43:41.550
[SPEAKER_05]: But these two always had good matches.

43:41.590 --> 43:46.413
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, even back when it was Dennis instead of Stan, and they were working in the various territories.

43:46.473 --> 43:51.476
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, the rock and rolls were the Midnight's most famous opponents, obviously.

43:51.496 --> 43:55.779
[SPEAKER_05]: And for good reason, the tactics might have been their best opponents, though, ever through the years.

43:56.019 --> 43:57.540
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, they never had a bad match.

43:58.021 --> 44:00.102
[SPEAKER_04]: So it looks like that air, you're right.

44:00.122 --> 44:02.704
[SPEAKER_04]: It was chatting, you got it aired on

44:03.678 --> 44:06.379
[SPEAKER_04]: worldwide on May, four cheek.

44:06.959 --> 44:09.320
[SPEAKER_04]: So about, yeah, about six weeks before the paper view.

44:10.941 --> 44:13.982
[SPEAKER_00]: I know that clash match we talked about on our clash of champions.

44:14.102 --> 44:16.723
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if I've seen unless you've sent that to us in the past.

44:21.785 --> 44:24.047
[SPEAKER_00]: Over the years Kyle, I don't know if I've ever seen that TV match.

44:24.067 --> 44:25.148
[SPEAKER_00]: I'll have to add that to my list.

44:25.949 --> 44:26.409
[SPEAKER_00]: For sure.

44:26.770 --> 44:32.595
[SPEAKER_00]: But that I mean, that's all I have down on the list and maybe talk about from ADA to any of you have anything else from that year.

44:33.576 --> 44:36.579
[SPEAKER_05]: The Maryland State Athletic Commission is a bunch of assholes.

44:37.940 --> 44:39.622
[SPEAKER_05]: What kind of idiot's finish was that?

44:41.403 --> 44:42.925
[SPEAKER_00]: Explain for the listeners.

44:45.502 --> 45:02.356
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, so the looger they did a great for and we'll talk more about looger the next year They did a great job building him up as the top baby face that early part of eighty eight But we know the story with Rick Rick didn't want to put over Lex and Lex got screwed because Rick had the match with sting at the first clash and everyone decided.

45:02.436 --> 45:03.677
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, so things not ready yet

45:04.538 --> 45:09.280
[SPEAKER_05]: But at some point, we're going to have Rick put over staying in the Sun will shine forever.

45:09.340 --> 45:10.620
[SPEAKER_05]: The sky will always be blue.

45:11.360 --> 45:14.181
[SPEAKER_05]: So we're just going to play everyone else kind of to take a back seat to that.

45:14.722 --> 45:17.883
[SPEAKER_05]: So we've got to kind of come up with a screwy finish for Rick and Lex.

45:19.315 --> 45:28.838
[SPEAKER_05]: And Lex does a weak blade job, and they use this lame rule from the state-up lot of commission that says there can't be blood to the rough stops match.

45:29.239 --> 45:34.060
[SPEAKER_05]: And if Lex needed to blade more, if they were going to do that finish, because it looks like a shaving cut.

45:35.101 --> 45:40.402
[SPEAKER_04]: That's really, I think that's why I get criticized so much because there is only a little bit of blood.

45:40.903 --> 45:42.203
[SPEAKER_04]: It keeps Lex strong.

45:43.220 --> 45:48.203
[SPEAKER_04]: Because the match ends as he's got flare in the torture rack, so the place explodes.

45:48.243 --> 45:50.624
[SPEAKER_04]: And if you watch the video, the place does explode.

45:51.544 --> 45:56.727
[SPEAKER_04]: And he kept the huge strong because they actually did good business into the fall with the rematches.

45:57.267 --> 46:06.391
[SPEAKER_04]: So everything worked except the blood needed a lot more blood plus this is eighties croquet.

46:06.411 --> 46:07.732
[SPEAKER_04]: We're used to a lot more blood.

46:09.067 --> 46:11.068
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm pretty sure we've talked about that on the show.

46:11.249 --> 46:12.810
[SPEAKER_00]: Did that come up during a flare draft?

46:13.550 --> 46:13.850
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

46:14.831 --> 46:17.133
[SPEAKER_00]: I feel like we have talked about this match before.

46:17.973 --> 46:19.734
[SPEAKER_05]: We talked about the Russell war flare, Luger.

46:19.774 --> 46:21.976
[SPEAKER_05]: I think it's going to finish in that too.

46:21.996 --> 46:22.977
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's what I'm thinking of.

46:23.017 --> 46:25.739
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, the horse that attacks staying outside the ring for Lex.

46:28.000 --> 46:31.823
[SPEAKER_04]: I hear, I hear they're following it put the bell tone on the, on the ninety one bash.

46:32.360 --> 46:32.961
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah.

46:33.741 --> 46:34.962
[SPEAKER_05]: This is finally the time.

46:35.002 --> 46:35.302
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.

46:36.223 --> 46:37.064
[SPEAKER_00]: All right.

46:37.104 --> 46:40.527
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, it's going to eighty nine because eighty nine is one of the great paper views of the era.

46:41.147 --> 46:43.309
[SPEAKER_00]: And we've been talking about this in our group text.

46:43.849 --> 46:48.733
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is where I'm going to really bring in Justin joins with the conversation because I know that this is his kind of match.

46:49.654 --> 46:54.378
[SPEAKER_00]: Talk to us about this Rick Flair Terry Funkmatch from Brad American Bash, eighty nine Justin.

46:55.445 --> 46:57.186
[SPEAKER_01]: playing in simple, it's a fight.

46:58.966 --> 47:02.888
[SPEAKER_01]: All these, the majority of the matches, them just slap each other's chest.

47:03.288 --> 47:04.309
[SPEAKER_01]: And it freaking works.

47:04.669 --> 47:12.572
[SPEAKER_01]: It totally works in not only is the match really good, but you have an all-timer brawl at the end where the high points are

47:13.672 --> 47:26.258
[SPEAKER_01]: the crowd just anticipating staying coming out and then him finally rushing the ring, him trying to fight off both Muda and Funk, and then you have flared just like all of a sudden appearing in the camera going after him.

47:27.018 --> 47:34.222
[SPEAKER_01]: And then my favorite part is you think it's over, staying in flared in the ring, flared bloody, green mist all over him.

47:35.283 --> 47:39.205
[SPEAKER_01]: And then I don't know which one, but either funk or mood it through a chair atom.

47:39.585 --> 47:43.928
[SPEAKER_01]: And it looks legit like Flare just lost his temper at that point.

47:43.968 --> 47:46.710
[SPEAKER_01]: And he goes, you know, hurtly now, they're going to go after him.

47:46.770 --> 47:47.891
[SPEAKER_01]: And they just keep fighting.

47:47.971 --> 47:52.474
[SPEAKER_01]: And yeah, all I can say, it's a physical fight of a wrestling match.

47:53.375 --> 47:53.575
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

47:54.456 --> 47:54.956
[SPEAKER_00]: Absolutely.

47:55.096 --> 47:56.057
[SPEAKER_00]: Grame your thoughts, I guess.

47:56.457 --> 47:58.318
[SPEAKER_04]: And that match did make my list.

47:59.459 --> 48:01.700
[SPEAKER_04]: I think a lot of folks, myself included love.

48:01.801 --> 48:03.442
[SPEAKER_04]: Everything topped the bottom with Bashit,

48:04.437 --> 48:11.600
[SPEAKER_04]: But Flair Funk is such a contrast from Flair Steamboat, which is what we had for six months prior.

48:12.440 --> 48:14.881
[SPEAKER_04]: This is just Flair, you know, is he going to retire?

48:15.722 --> 48:17.282
[SPEAKER_04]: Funk pallid rise among the table.

48:17.402 --> 48:21.744
[SPEAKER_04]: We don't know if Flair is in and if he's going to stay in the business, if he's going to keep the title.

48:23.205 --> 48:24.005
[SPEAKER_04]: It's a fight.

48:24.425 --> 48:28.987
[SPEAKER_04]: And also the surprise of Gary Hart is Terry Funk's new manager.

48:29.407 --> 48:31.028
[SPEAKER_04]: Gary Hart is also managing Muda.

48:31.408 --> 48:33.829
[SPEAKER_04]: So they do a phenomenal job.

48:34.443 --> 48:40.308
[SPEAKER_04]: of not only giving us pay off in the man of it, but also getting us to how we have it.

48:41.369 --> 48:41.549
[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

48:42.710 --> 48:44.572
[SPEAKER_05]: I was going to put the website over grabbing this hit.

48:44.592 --> 48:46.414
[SPEAKER_05]: This is like the kind of stuff that people want to see.

48:46.434 --> 48:47.955
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, you can see after the match.

48:48.656 --> 48:52.499
[SPEAKER_05]: Gary Hart's first time managing Terry Funk in front of the season right afterwards.

48:52.519 --> 48:54.421
[SPEAKER_05]: So you get that good frame of reference.

48:54.781 --> 48:55.322
[SPEAKER_05]: I think

48:57.013 --> 48:58.054
[SPEAKER_05]: Actually, first of all, let me say this.

48:58.454 --> 49:01.535
[SPEAKER_05]: I love a match coming off just a hot angle, right?

49:01.635 --> 49:05.837
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, I mean, it's an all-time angle that they do at rest of war, eighty-nine with funk punk.

49:06.017 --> 49:14.702
[SPEAKER_05]: And after birth, cult of coordinate people, by the way, love to hear your take on that, the dreaded after birth word, but I just, you know,

49:15.622 --> 49:16.924
[SPEAKER_05]: There's just no angle like that.

49:16.984 --> 49:18.606
[SPEAKER_05]: It just makes you anticipate a match.

49:18.646 --> 49:19.928
[SPEAKER_05]: I feel today, right?

49:20.629 --> 49:23.033
[SPEAKER_05]: Then just go like, I mean, you're just it's freaking go time.

49:23.053 --> 49:26.277
[SPEAKER_05]: You're kind of like rocking back and forth and you're seat waiting for this to start.

49:26.357 --> 49:28.841
[SPEAKER_05]: Flare comes out with the ladies rushes the ring and it's on.

49:29.742 --> 49:30.163
[SPEAKER_05]: I think

49:31.165 --> 49:37.550
[SPEAKER_05]: that maybe other than the Vader match at Starcade, this is peak baby face Rick Flare.

49:37.570 --> 49:45.416
[SPEAKER_05]: We talked about it as a bully heel earlier, but there's a little sympathy which you don't associate with Rick Flare often, right?

49:45.916 --> 49:51.661
[SPEAKER_05]: And the point's grand made about is you're gonna be able to retire the pre-match interview.

49:51.721 --> 49:55.524
[SPEAKER_05]: All that stuff was cut on the Turner Home Entertainment version.

49:55.544 --> 50:00.167
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I don't remember seeing a lot of these interviews when I went back and watched this on the network.

50:01.273 --> 50:06.518
[SPEAKER_05]: But that interview with Gordon was great before Alan Gordon was like, Rick, you haven't even had a warm up match.

50:06.538 --> 50:07.559
[SPEAKER_05]: Do you think you're going to be okay?

50:07.899 --> 50:10.121
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, it is just really, really good stuff.

50:10.141 --> 50:13.965
[SPEAKER_05]: And I'm just thinking I'm like, man, I don't know if Rick has ever been in better as a baby face than he was in this match.

50:14.606 --> 50:21.532
[SPEAKER_05]: And the crazy thing is we all know Rick Flair's, in the United States, he had a better match with Terry Funk than this believe it or not later.

50:21.572 --> 50:22.353
[SPEAKER_05]: That's what's insane.

50:25.083 --> 50:25.663
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, go ahead, Justin.

50:25.903 --> 50:31.086
[SPEAKER_01]: Well, I was my one little criticism of the match and I and I loved it, but rewashing it back.

50:31.106 --> 50:42.051
[SPEAKER_01]: He kind of took me back as it does seem like they they brought out the pile driver kind of in the middle of the match and it didn't really play into it all that much considering the hype of it.

50:42.071 --> 50:45.853
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, I honestly don't even remember.

50:45.873 --> 50:50.655
[SPEAKER_05]: You mean what Rick did or when thought was going when when funk got the pile driver on Rick?

50:52.947 --> 50:57.451
[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know, I think it was far enough along because right, the flare puts us like on the rope afterwards, right?

50:58.392 --> 51:07.099
[SPEAKER_05]: That's how they get out of the spot because, yeah, because you're right, they sell it a little bit and it's like, oh, I think Rick's gonna lose and it's, yeah, I think he gets us foot on the rope to get out of it.

51:07.259 --> 51:10.122
[SPEAKER_05]: But they go home, not long after, I think.

51:12.338 --> 51:15.802
[SPEAKER_04]: And it's not an altogether decisive victory either.

51:16.162 --> 51:17.724
[SPEAKER_04]: Like he doesn't beat fun.

51:18.005 --> 51:22.149
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, that's the beat of the month or three, but he doesn't overpower him dominant.

51:22.349 --> 51:23.371
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because we're great.

51:23.471 --> 51:23.671
[SPEAKER_00]: Great.

51:23.711 --> 51:26.274
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the dude had to continue obviously.

51:26.294 --> 51:27.856
[SPEAKER_05]: They went to Halloween have it can be on.

51:27.896 --> 51:32.641
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, but you know, that post-match brawl my god, makes you want to see if the tag match would just and brings up

51:33.642 --> 51:36.306
[SPEAKER_05]: the crowd wanting to see sting out there to make the safe.

51:36.767 --> 51:38.349
[SPEAKER_05]: I love that and miss that.

51:38.389 --> 51:40.433
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, I know I said, so I miss this in today's lesson.

51:40.813 --> 51:46.622
[SPEAKER_05]: The crowd wanting a specific person to come out and help and then getting rewarded.

51:46.642 --> 51:47.543
[SPEAKER_05]: That's just so awesome.

51:49.169 --> 51:49.550
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

51:49.790 --> 51:55.758
[SPEAKER_00]: You watch this match on Peacock and then it's over and you see that there's around fifteen minutes left running time.

51:55.778 --> 51:56.720
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm like, what's going to happen?

51:56.760 --> 52:00.124
[SPEAKER_00]: And then you stay in and you get that massive brawl, the great promo.

52:00.725 --> 52:01.686
[SPEAKER_00]: It's good good stuff.

52:01.747 --> 52:04.010
[SPEAKER_00]: Rick Flare's nineteen eighty nine stands apart.

52:04.050 --> 52:04.550
[SPEAKER_00]: I think from

52:05.291 --> 52:08.092
[SPEAKER_00]: any other performer in the history of wrestling.

52:08.112 --> 52:09.993
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think that we're talking about this yesterday.

52:10.013 --> 52:19.116
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't think any wrestler has ever had an eighty nine like year that compares to Rick Flair from that year because you have him doing, you know, early in the year with steamboat.

52:19.276 --> 52:19.856
[SPEAKER_00]: He's a heel.

52:19.916 --> 52:20.396
[SPEAKER_00]: He pivots.

52:20.416 --> 52:21.617
[SPEAKER_00]: He becomes a baby face.

52:21.677 --> 52:21.977
[SPEAKER_00]: He works.

52:22.457 --> 52:28.764
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, the brawling style with Terry Funk, and he had the more technical matches with Ricky Steamboat.

52:29.244 --> 52:36.612
[SPEAKER_00]: I put this out on Twitter yesterday, and I had one person say, yeah, I kind of agree, but what about Ocada in, in, in, in, in, in, in, in.

52:37.252 --> 52:38.313
[SPEAKER_00]: And my response was,

52:39.074 --> 52:42.256
[SPEAKER_00]: I love Ocata, I love those matches he had in the year.

52:42.756 --> 52:53.542
[SPEAKER_00]: But I don't really feel like people are going to be waxing poetic about those matches in the same way in thirty years because, you know, to Kyle's point, how badly you wanted to see these matches.

52:53.662 --> 52:58.865
[SPEAKER_00]: And the way that they built them up with that awesome angle, with the pile driver and the table with Terry Funtlet.

52:59.445 --> 53:07.489
[SPEAKER_00]: I just, I don't know, but what you think about that grand, but I don't see any wrestler in the history of the business that's ever had a year that compares to Rick Flair's, nineteen eighty-nine.

53:07.550 --> 53:08.370
[SPEAKER_00]: It's just unbelievable.

53:08.909 --> 53:11.770
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, they're both all-time classic feuds.

53:12.050 --> 53:12.310
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

53:12.871 --> 53:15.151
[SPEAKER_04]: And when I say feuds, I don't just mean matches.

53:15.271 --> 53:17.752
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean the storytelling between the matches.

53:17.812 --> 53:19.953
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean the promos between the matches.

53:21.694 --> 53:26.976
[SPEAKER_04]: To have something that you could do on television every single week.

53:27.436 --> 53:29.317
[SPEAKER_04]: Maybe it's only a one minute promo.

53:29.637 --> 53:37.400
[SPEAKER_04]: But do something on television every single week to build up to a blow-off and, you know, a month's time, two months time, whatever.

53:37.897 --> 53:47.190
[SPEAKER_04]: And that's, I love, eighty-nine, and WCW, because it of all the fresh talents that's coming in, but also these headlining matches and these headlining views.

53:48.920 --> 53:50.741
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, certainly the storytelling sets of the part.

53:50.801 --> 54:06.009
[SPEAKER_00]: I think from, yeah, Ocada had tons of really good five star matches in in two thousand and sixteen great ringwork, but I just think from the total picture to seeing two sides of the Rickflair character, to that ongoing storytelling week after week that it's just it stands apart.

54:06.389 --> 54:07.990
[SPEAKER_00]: And it stands the test the time really.

54:08.030 --> 54:12.332
[SPEAKER_00]: You watch a match like this and it makes you want to relive everything in between until you get to the havoc match too.

54:13.790 --> 54:15.874
[SPEAKER_01]: Can I point out one more thing about this card?

54:16.275 --> 54:18.019
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

54:18.560 --> 54:23.710
[SPEAKER_01]: This is for Kyle's heart when it comes to kind of bashing the current product.

54:25.181 --> 54:36.410
[SPEAKER_01]: You look at the midcard of this match, and you have a, and part of this is looking at Dave Meltzer's star radiates, which is not the be all end all of, if a wrestling match is good.

54:36.450 --> 54:50.260
[SPEAKER_01]: But you have the Steiner's first Kevin Sullivan and Mike Rotundo, three stars followed by sting versus Great Moota, three and three quarters, I believe, and then following that, Luger steamboat, four and a quarter.

54:51.021 --> 54:52.262
[SPEAKER_01]: Now what I want to point out is,

54:53.312 --> 54:56.554
[SPEAKER_01]: The first match I noted, four minutes, twenty-two seconds.

54:56.794 --> 55:01.538
[SPEAKER_01]: The next one, eight minutes, forty seconds, and finally, ten minutes and twenty-six seconds.

55:02.772 --> 55:03.773
[SPEAKER_05]: Stuffed in overstates.

55:03.813 --> 55:04.633
[SPEAKER_05]: Welcome back, Dad.

55:06.154 --> 55:07.975
[SPEAKER_05]: People paid to see the main event back then.

55:07.995 --> 55:15.280
[SPEAKER_05]: It wasn't like I am paying for three and a half hours of that unique brand of entertainment that only the world wrestling Federation could supply.

55:15.760 --> 55:17.822
[SPEAKER_05]: It's, you know, they wanted to get to the main event.

55:17.902 --> 55:21.564
[SPEAKER_05]: And so that's why undercard matches never overstayed their work.

55:21.664 --> 55:26.567
[SPEAKER_05]: It was very rare that anything on an undercard back then would go more than fifteen minutes.

55:26.967 --> 55:28.568
[SPEAKER_04]: But also in space to the time.

55:28.669 --> 55:30.550
[SPEAKER_04]: Like today, we expect

55:31.130 --> 55:36.272
[SPEAKER_04]: undercard matches to go, I don't know, twenty-three minutes, but you don't need that to have a memorable match.

55:36.672 --> 55:44.954
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, you know, you being, you holding a headlock for five minutes or, you know, doing something just to stretch up the time in the match doesn't make it more memorable.

55:45.234 --> 55:46.155
[SPEAKER_04]: It just makes it longer.

55:46.655 --> 55:50.436
[SPEAKER_04]: And these, these shorter matches, these are the ones that we're talking about for three years later.

55:51.041 --> 56:06.449
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I mean, to that point, I brought this up on the show before when people talk about the Okada Omega series, I've always said my favorite match of that series is the G-One match they had, which is way, way shorter, you know, than the Russell Kingdom match is for example, but it's a sprint.

56:06.849 --> 56:07.529
[SPEAKER_00]: And I like that.

56:07.589 --> 56:08.690
[SPEAKER_00]: I like the shorter matches.

56:09.270 --> 56:09.830
[SPEAKER_00]: War games.

56:10.030 --> 56:14.693
[SPEAKER_00]: You just talked about the first War games, you guys brought up the ninety-two War games match.

56:15.313 --> 56:17.535
[SPEAKER_00]: Those matches are all about twenty five minutes.

56:18.235 --> 56:22.719
[SPEAKER_00]: A little bit less and when they do war games in NXT, they're forty five minutes long.

56:22.879 --> 56:26.421
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you don't have to have a forty five minute long war games match for to be a great match.

56:26.481 --> 56:33.667
[SPEAKER_04]: None of the all-time classic ones for that long and their spectacles to right because at the end of the match, everyone has to be basically dead.

56:34.247 --> 56:57.663
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well, that's the other thing to the not to go back a little bit, but with that eighty seven word games match is There's so much happening in the ring all at the same time versus the way WWE lays out matches when they're multi-person matches like this is it like two guys are doing something and everyone else is just like laying there watching them and then two other guys get up and they do something and everyone else watches them

56:58.003 --> 57:02.505
[SPEAKER_00]: Sometimes there's a few things going on, but not like what you see in AD seven.

57:02.565 --> 57:03.985
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a whole different product.

57:04.686 --> 57:09.187
[SPEAKER_04]: It's like a real life chaos, whereas today there's a lot of people playing dead.

57:09.627 --> 57:11.448
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, like that's not how people really fight.

57:11.868 --> 57:12.048
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

57:12.348 --> 57:13.469
[SPEAKER_00]: You're watching that just today.

57:13.569 --> 57:14.589
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, man.

57:14.649 --> 57:15.670
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like a real fight.

57:15.690 --> 57:16.370
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

57:16.390 --> 57:18.031
[SPEAKER_05]: Imagine just laying around in a war games.

57:18.311 --> 57:19.951
[SPEAKER_05]: Why would you do something like that?

57:21.252 --> 57:22.772
[SPEAKER_04]: Just not time for my spot.

57:22.972 --> 57:23.693
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, exactly.

57:23.713 --> 57:23.973
[SPEAKER_04]: Exactly.

57:24.013 --> 57:24.353
[SPEAKER_05]: Exactly.

57:24.653 --> 57:28.697
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, in the interest of time, I don't know how much everyone just referenced it.

57:28.797 --> 57:29.177
[SPEAKER_05]: I'll just throw it.

57:29.377 --> 57:31.259
[SPEAKER_05]: There's one other match from this show that made my list.

57:31.299 --> 57:36.324
[SPEAKER_05]: And certainly, Bashi D. Nine, I think, is deserving of multiple matches on a list like this.

57:36.524 --> 57:43.770
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, it's like, you know, a god tier pay per view in my opinion, the Luger Steamboat match is so awesome.

57:44.691 --> 57:45.732
[SPEAKER_05]: And we've talked about before.

57:45.752 --> 57:48.695
[SPEAKER_05]: I believe when did this for Halloween havoc, guys?

57:49.965 --> 58:08.414
[SPEAKER_05]: Nineteen eighty-nine Lex Luger if you have like a Concept of Lex Luger you need to put it to the side and watch nineteen eighty-nine Lex cuz this man was the god of the smart mark community Jim Ross acknowledges it on commentaries like some people actually still tear the sky and I don't understand why

58:09.074 --> 58:12.597
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, I mean, the smart Mark Croft loved eighty-nine Lex.

58:12.997 --> 58:14.138
[SPEAKER_05]: I love eighty-nine Lex.

58:14.459 --> 58:15.420
[SPEAKER_05]: I love this match.

58:15.700 --> 58:18.802
[SPEAKER_05]: I see Graham shaking his head and that makes me feel very good at it.

58:19.203 --> 58:21.745
[SPEAKER_04]: I've had a long standing theory when it comes to Lex.

58:21.785 --> 58:22.766
[SPEAKER_04]: And I'm right there with you.

58:22.846 --> 58:23.947
[SPEAKER_04]: I love Lex and eighty-nine.

58:24.607 --> 58:30.713
[SPEAKER_04]: The longer his hair is, the better he does, the better he does what he did.

58:30.933 --> 58:32.054
[SPEAKER_04]: It is that he needs to do.

58:32.354 --> 58:32.855
[SPEAKER_00]: That sounds like so.

58:32.915 --> 58:33.835
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that theory.

58:34.156 --> 58:35.117
[SPEAKER_03]: I love that theory.

58:35.637 --> 58:35.877
[SPEAKER_04]: Sure.

58:35.917 --> 58:36.238
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't care.

58:36.278 --> 58:36.658
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't like.

58:37.576 --> 58:42.261
[SPEAKER_04]: Sure, here, like, especially like, ninety three legs would like, like, express legs.

58:42.641 --> 58:45.284
[SPEAKER_04]: No, no, because all the power comes from the hair.

58:46.365 --> 58:49.248
[SPEAKER_01]: He, he, he just, he didn't sweat like he did back in those days.

58:49.569 --> 58:49.949
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

58:53.510 --> 58:58.157
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, what was fascinating about I had never thought of that, but you're now I'm not going to be able to unsee it now.

58:58.197 --> 59:03.084
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, I've got the match in my hand, and I'm just like, it's Luger's hair is like the one thing I'm seeing.

59:03.425 --> 59:07.671
[SPEAKER_05]: But what's fascinating about this match with steam mode, a particular is

59:08.552 --> 59:35.225
[SPEAKER_05]: Lex is like feeding steam but like you don't like it seems so odd like you don't see looser do that because he worked a lot as a baby face but you know you take the shot gets right back up take the shot gets you know he's back down you didn't see Lex could move man in eighty nine and I'll say it again I think he should have got the title as a heel at the end of the year right I think the instead of rush the stink thing or just be hardheaded about it I really do and I think then

59:36.005 --> 59:41.506
[SPEAKER_05]: You would have two baby faces opposed to them, flare and sting, nineteen ninety would have a lot better.

59:43.226 --> 59:44.007
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't know argument.

59:44.447 --> 59:45.087
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, no argument.

59:45.607 --> 59:55.849
[SPEAKER_04]: The more I watched stuff of that area, I fully believe that Russell were ninety where they had to turn him baby face because of stinging up a man.

59:55.889 --> 01:00:00.470
[SPEAKER_04]: He was white hot as a heel, you know, destroying stinging, destroying flare.

01:00:00.903 --> 01:00:02.104
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, I'm the guy.

01:00:02.284 --> 01:00:03.364
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm the US champion.

01:00:03.484 --> 01:00:04.725
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm the never one contender.

01:00:05.145 --> 01:00:06.366
[SPEAKER_04]: Nobody can take this from me.

01:00:06.526 --> 01:00:11.988
[SPEAKER_04]: And now I'm going to take the world title to and no one could stop him until he turned baby face and then everyone could stop him.

01:00:12.008 --> 01:00:16.210
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and that that really suck because it the stingy injury obviously affected him.

01:00:16.270 --> 01:00:19.272
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, he goes because I believe the plan was

01:00:20.172 --> 01:00:27.735
[SPEAKER_05]: Sting wins at Russell or him and Luger were going to then work on top the rest of here because Luger had pinned him in that goofy gauntlet thing they did at Starcade.

01:00:28.256 --> 01:00:28.836
[SPEAKER_05]: That makes sense.

01:00:29.176 --> 01:00:30.457
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and that would have been great.

01:00:30.477 --> 01:00:33.018
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, God, that's sting the injury.

01:00:33.878 --> 01:00:38.540
[SPEAKER_05]: Has there ever been a more catastrophic injury to a promotion than that?

01:00:40.101 --> 01:00:47.304
[SPEAKER_04]: But the blow-off, and now we're here talking about the blow-off at the bash with him coming back and we're in the role title.

01:00:48.630 --> 01:01:04.375
[SPEAKER_04]: That's like what we remember of nineteen ninety w sub you like for whatever it was intended to be that pinnacle moment involved more is such a big moment is such a big deal it's such a you know a what the rest of the year surrounds

01:01:05.292 --> 01:01:14.621
[SPEAKER_05]: I guess I just framed it like that because, you know, I joked earlier, when sting becomes World Champion, the Sun would shine forever, and the sky would always be blue in their minds, and that didn't happen.

01:01:15.061 --> 01:01:20.666
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, this just didn't go up at all, whether that big, and it just, it feels like had sting won the title as planned.

01:01:21.607 --> 01:01:28.213
[SPEAKER_05]: May, in the early part of the year, they would be able to keep Luger heel and things would have been more logical, and I think maybe better.

01:01:30.762 --> 01:01:49.364
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, let's move ahead to nineteen ninety so I think there's a tag team match that's uh... is going to be mentioned uh... nineteen ninety dubbed the new revolution and uh... certainly not new because you've got the southern boys here with the confederate flags taken on of the midnight express Kyle your huge fan of this match

01:01:50.323 --> 01:01:51.924
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, the nights are my favorite team ever.

01:01:51.944 --> 01:01:53.524
[SPEAKER_05]: It's my favorite match of theirs.

01:01:53.924 --> 01:02:00.807
[SPEAKER_05]: And I'll say it's either this or steamboat and dust and versus the enforcers at Clash Seventeen.

01:02:00.827 --> 01:02:04.068
[SPEAKER_05]: That's my favorite WCW tag of the decade.

01:02:04.088 --> 01:02:06.989
[SPEAKER_05]: Those are high words of praise from Kyle Ross.

01:02:07.369 --> 01:02:10.390
[SPEAKER_04]: So full disclosure, this match also made my list.

01:02:11.471 --> 01:02:17.173
[SPEAKER_04]: And the the Clash match, I should let you all know, I'm a half an hour from Savannah.

01:02:17.870 --> 01:02:21.375
[SPEAKER_04]: So I passed the Savannah exhibit on a regular basis.

01:02:22.137 --> 01:02:22.978
[SPEAKER_04]: And I always think

01:02:23.773 --> 01:02:25.855
[SPEAKER_04]: That's where Sting pulled in in the ambulance.

01:02:27.296 --> 01:02:29.237
[SPEAKER_05]: And he went to the rock door.

01:02:29.257 --> 01:02:32.800
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, man.

01:02:33.460 --> 01:02:33.800
[SPEAKER_00]: I love that.

01:02:33.840 --> 01:02:41.446
[SPEAKER_00]: That's similar to, um, or an hour north of Cedar Rapids where they had the clash of champions were Hogan got attacked and they took him to the hospital.

01:02:41.746 --> 01:02:46.870
[SPEAKER_00]: And whenever I go by that hospital on the interstate, I always think a, that ninety-four clash with Hogan going to the hospital.

01:02:46.970 --> 01:02:47.170
[SPEAKER_00]: St.

01:02:47.210 --> 01:02:47.950
[SPEAKER_00]: Luke's, I think it is.

01:02:48.271 --> 01:02:49.051
[SPEAKER_00]: It was eight to time.

01:02:49.411 --> 01:02:52.834
[SPEAKER_05]: Now, do you always refer to as a local medical facility or back called hospital?

01:02:53.134 --> 01:02:58.618
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, I always say there's that local medical facility in my wife, Logan once resided there for a little while.

01:03:00.099 --> 01:03:04.363
[SPEAKER_00]: No, but, no, yeah, this is, it's an awesome match for sure.

01:03:04.383 --> 01:03:05.404
[SPEAKER_00]: I went back and watched this.

01:03:05.804 --> 01:03:08.246
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, again, like the Midnight Express is not a tag team.

01:03:08.266 --> 01:03:09.627
[SPEAKER_00]: I was very familiar with growing up.

01:03:09.667 --> 01:03:13.470
[SPEAKER_00]: And a lot of what I've watched at the Midnight Express has been Kyle's recommendations.

01:03:14.090 --> 01:03:17.273
[SPEAKER_00]: And this was one that he was speaking glowingly about.

01:03:17.573 --> 01:03:20.015
[SPEAKER_00]: And it definitely definitely lived up to the hype.

01:03:20.635 --> 01:03:25.177
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, people should listen to coordinates review of this patch.

01:03:25.197 --> 01:03:26.698
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, I know Jim Quarts, that's very divisive.

01:03:26.958 --> 01:03:29.139
[SPEAKER_05]: I certainly wildly disagree with them sometimes.

01:03:29.159 --> 01:03:35.621
[SPEAKER_05]: Sometimes I completely have on board, but he is in his elements on his podcast reviewing this patch.

01:03:35.661 --> 01:03:41.684
[SPEAKER_05]: Like, it's a really good, forty-five-minute listen, especially if you know the match well, you don't have to watch them along with them.

01:03:42.364 --> 01:03:46.546
[SPEAKER_05]: Him just breaking down every spot, why it worked, why maybe it could have gone better.

01:03:46.946 --> 01:03:49.207
[SPEAKER_05]: It's tremendous tremendous stuff.

01:03:51.780 --> 01:03:56.262
[SPEAKER_04]: And also something to consider, the Southern Boys were not established.

01:03:56.542 --> 01:03:56.862
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes.

01:03:57.822 --> 01:04:00.063
[SPEAKER_04]: The Midnight Express for the US Titan Champions.

01:04:00.483 --> 01:04:08.426
[SPEAKER_04]: So like they're the old hat, and this is not supposed to be that competitive of a match, but it ends up being a star-making match.

01:04:09.245 --> 01:04:13.506
[SPEAKER_05]: It's funny you bring that up because Cornet spends the first part of the podcast talking about what you're saying.

01:04:13.747 --> 01:04:16.928
[SPEAKER_05]: No one really knew the Southern boys are the crowd is the crowd even going to be behind them.

01:04:17.468 --> 01:04:19.248
[SPEAKER_05]: And he's like, I don't really care what the office says.

01:04:19.268 --> 01:04:21.769
[SPEAKER_05]: We're going to spend the first five minutes getting these guys over and the crowd into it.

01:04:22.109 --> 01:04:26.811
[SPEAKER_05]: And it's like that, like it's just really good to listen to like how he his thought process on it.

01:04:27.777 --> 01:04:28.317
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, nice.

01:04:28.417 --> 01:04:29.758
[SPEAKER_00]: I, yeah, you sent that to us.

01:04:29.818 --> 01:04:31.479
[SPEAKER_00]: I am going to check that out for sure.

01:04:32.059 --> 01:04:33.439
[SPEAKER_00]: Um, ninety one.

01:04:33.459 --> 01:04:33.539
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:04:35.660 --> 01:04:46.945
[SPEAKER_00]: Kyle, you mentioned to us the other day that I, you might mention this off air that you went back and you had never seen ninety one and you put it on and it is just as bad as the reputation for seated.

01:04:47.525 --> 01:04:47.685
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.

01:04:47.705 --> 01:04:50.887
[SPEAKER_05]: So I had never watched it before because

01:04:52.063 --> 01:04:52.883
[SPEAKER_05]: of the reputation.

01:04:52.924 --> 01:04:55.185
[SPEAKER_05]: I was like, well, why would I, you know, in the tape trading, isn't it?

01:04:55.225 --> 01:04:58.466
[SPEAKER_05]: Why would I pay money for something that's regarded as so hideous?

01:04:58.526 --> 01:04:59.347
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm not going to watch that.

01:05:00.167 --> 01:05:02.348
[SPEAKER_05]: And then the network came out and I never thought to put it on.

01:05:02.789 --> 01:05:06.331
[SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, I'm doing where ninety-one now, me and Liam review in that.

01:05:06.371 --> 01:05:09.592
[SPEAKER_05]: We're talking about flair jumping ship from WCWF.

01:05:09.632 --> 01:05:11.933
[SPEAKER_05]: And I'm, a lot of great American bash.

01:05:11.954 --> 01:05:13.094
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, I've never watched a show.

01:05:13.114 --> 01:05:14.575
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to put it on and good lord.

01:05:14.755 --> 01:05:16.776
[SPEAKER_05]: It might actually be worse than people say.

01:05:16.836 --> 01:05:19.918
[SPEAKER_05]: I've just never seen a more depressing show.

01:05:21.554 --> 01:05:27.476
[SPEAKER_05]: Maybe I'm looking for it, but every performer that comes out just has this look on their face like the show sucks.

01:05:28.456 --> 01:05:29.116
[SPEAKER_05]: Don't want to be here.

01:05:29.876 --> 01:05:31.777
[SPEAKER_05]: And as Graham, you know, joked earlier.

01:05:32.197 --> 01:05:36.598
[SPEAKER_05]: No, Lex Luger does not win the title from Rick Flare at the show because Rick Flare doesn't bother to show up.

01:05:38.039 --> 01:05:42.320
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so I certainly didn't have anything from ninety one on my list.

01:05:42.340 --> 01:05:49.902
[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know if Graham, if you had anything else from ninety on your list, I should have given you that opportunity or finally chance you have something from ninety one.

01:05:50.520 --> 01:05:52.101
[SPEAKER_04]: Nothing nothing else from ninety.

01:05:53.361 --> 01:06:03.366
[SPEAKER_04]: I'm sure you guys know, but I did a book on the Baltimore Arena several years ago and and all these major shows are just, you know, this, this is the home with the work of a creator-maker bash for so many years.

01:06:04.126 --> 01:06:07.167
[SPEAKER_04]: But ninety one, it is rough.

01:06:07.968 --> 01:06:13.690
[SPEAKER_04]: But if you look at ninety one from beginning to end, the whole year is bad.

01:06:13.710 --> 01:06:17.952
[SPEAKER_04]: Like the only thing that makes the bash stand out so much is the absence of

01:06:19.977 --> 01:06:23.780
[SPEAKER_04]: And there's not a main event to save it.

01:06:24.661 --> 01:06:25.262
[SPEAKER_04]: Save the show.

01:06:25.562 --> 01:06:27.303
[SPEAKER_04]: So, Russell Warden, anyone?

01:06:27.423 --> 01:06:28.044
[SPEAKER_04]: War games.

01:06:28.384 --> 01:06:29.125
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll give you that.

01:06:30.046 --> 01:06:35.350
[SPEAKER_04]: Super brawl one, you know, the most memorable things, diners against Stingham Luger.

01:06:35.430 --> 01:06:35.951
[SPEAKER_04]: I'll give you that.

01:06:35.971 --> 01:06:37.652
[SPEAKER_04]: That's like a match of the year kind of match.

01:06:38.353 --> 01:06:39.253
[SPEAKER_04]: And then you get here.

01:06:39.714 --> 01:06:44.638
[SPEAKER_04]: And the one guy who typically saves the paper view got fired.

01:06:46.311 --> 01:06:50.272
[SPEAKER_04]: So now you've got all these new characters like Johnny B. Bad.

01:06:50.712 --> 01:06:51.912
[SPEAKER_04]: You've got eyes.

01:06:52.092 --> 01:06:53.112
[SPEAKER_04]: You've got all these guys.

01:06:53.312 --> 01:06:54.333
[SPEAKER_04]: No one is over.

01:06:55.233 --> 01:06:59.054
[SPEAKER_04]: And then the guys who are established, you've got the rock and roll express against each other.

01:06:59.394 --> 01:07:01.774
[SPEAKER_04]: So you took the hottest tag team and you split them up.

01:07:01.794 --> 01:07:03.315
[SPEAKER_04]: So you killed your hottest tag team.

01:07:03.855 --> 01:07:10.476
[SPEAKER_04]: But then the other guys like Barry Wendom, who is a heel, let's look at who is a baby face.

01:07:11.956 --> 01:07:14.877
[SPEAKER_04]: And then you switched them after the match.

01:07:15.683 --> 01:07:18.946
[SPEAKER_04]: So now, who's your top baby face?

01:07:19.686 --> 01:07:22.368
[SPEAKER_04]: Because your top baby face is now your role champion heel.

01:07:23.069 --> 01:07:25.631
[SPEAKER_04]: So there's really nothing, nothing at all.

01:07:26.031 --> 01:07:32.096
[SPEAKER_04]: And an interviewing for the book and interviewing so many fans who were there that night, some of them walked in the building.

01:07:32.897 --> 01:07:35.779
[SPEAKER_04]: That night, not knowing Flair had been fired.

01:07:37.500 --> 01:07:38.381
[SPEAKER_04]: Because it happened.

01:07:38.461 --> 01:07:40.743
[SPEAKER_04]: So I mean, it was like a week, ten days, whatever.

01:07:40.783 --> 01:07:43.205
[SPEAKER_04]: So if you missed one weekend of television,

01:07:43.757 --> 01:07:53.297
[SPEAKER_04]: and you walk in having tickets for the show and you sit down and there's a piece of paper there saying that Rick Flare will not appear blah blah blah blah blah what's the main event

01:07:55.150 --> 01:08:00.056
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because I think it was just with one week, they ran a crawl or on the final week of television or something.

01:08:00.596 --> 01:08:01.858
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it was a different time.

01:08:01.878 --> 01:08:05.822
[SPEAKER_05]: You didn't have the internet to just push the scoops out back in ninety one.

01:08:06.283 --> 01:08:08.305
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, what folly on that show?

01:08:08.546 --> 01:08:09.607
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not just flare leaving.

01:08:09.947 --> 01:08:13.231
[SPEAKER_05]: They have the scaffold match, which is so dangerous.

01:08:13.972 --> 01:08:21.998
[SPEAKER_05]: Like the scaffold is so thin and the four guys beforehand were like, I don't feel comfortable doing this and I'm not taking a bump.

01:08:22.659 --> 01:08:27.603
[SPEAKER_05]: So they changed the rules the day off to capture the flag like it's gym class.

01:08:28.564 --> 01:08:29.605
[SPEAKER_05]: No one does anything.

01:08:29.645 --> 01:08:37.431
[SPEAKER_05]: It just four guys holding on for dear life hoping not to fall off this thing and freaking PN news grabs a flag to win.

01:08:38.151 --> 01:08:38.632
[SPEAKER_05]: That's fun.

01:08:39.052 --> 01:08:43.893
[SPEAKER_04]: The most memorable thing about that match is it's Don Cold Steve Austin's paperview debut.

01:08:44.614 --> 01:08:44.834
[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.

01:08:45.674 --> 01:08:48.275
[SPEAKER_05]: And he's the first guy who is that boo-boo face.

01:08:49.075 --> 01:08:51.956
[SPEAKER_05]: When I thought what it's like, I wish I would be anywhere, buddy.

01:08:52.356 --> 01:08:55.256
[SPEAKER_05]: I wish I would make my paperview debut at a different time.

01:08:55.296 --> 01:08:59.598
[SPEAKER_05]: And then the main event is not Luger Wind of it's this mixed tag.

01:09:00.358 --> 01:09:04.059
[SPEAKER_05]: It was Rick Steiner and Missy, you guys are gonna love this, Ryan, just to be honest.

01:09:04.199 --> 01:09:07.880
[SPEAKER_05]: Rick Steiner and Missy, hi it against Aaron Anderson and Paul Lee.

01:09:08.874 --> 01:09:10.115
[SPEAKER_05]: They've been hyping it for a while.

01:09:11.455 --> 01:09:18.998
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, the Maryland State Athletic Commissioners, it's had again, and you can't have a match with a woman and a man.

01:09:20.179 --> 01:09:24.281
[SPEAKER_05]: So they take, missy, high it out before the match.

01:09:24.301 --> 01:09:26.922
[SPEAKER_05]: I think the hard light, yes, it is the hard lighters capture her.

01:09:27.342 --> 01:09:28.963
[SPEAKER_05]: They, and Dick Slater, Dick Murdoch.

01:09:31.192 --> 01:09:34.556
[SPEAKER_05]: A fan tries saving Missy from their clutches.

01:09:35.216 --> 01:09:36.337
[SPEAKER_05]: And do you remember the scrum?

01:09:36.798 --> 01:09:42.864
[SPEAKER_04]: No, I remember the whole scenario is just ridiculous and it's getting more ridiculous.

01:09:42.884 --> 01:09:48.350
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I can't remember if it's Murdoch or Slater, one of them just takes a while swing at the fan.

01:09:50.295 --> 01:09:51.576
[SPEAKER_05]: and drops missing.

01:09:52.577 --> 01:09:53.297
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, I'll do it again.

01:09:53.897 --> 01:10:06.625
[SPEAKER_05]: So they have to, so they've been high because it turns into a handy cat match, Rick Steiner vs. Arna Anderson and Paul Lee in a steel cage and Rick Steiner pins Paul Lee and it's very, very bad.

01:10:07.586 --> 01:10:11.348
[SPEAKER_04]: So I'm turn remember what the original match was because I was he's got is that hurt?

01:10:12.089 --> 01:10:12.329
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes.

01:10:12.649 --> 01:10:15.091
[SPEAKER_04]: And I think, oh, Barry, Arna and Barry.

01:10:15.590 --> 01:10:18.392
[SPEAKER_04]: against the stioners and maybe maybe missing.

01:10:18.472 --> 01:10:23.555
[SPEAKER_05]: But Paulie and Missy were definitely supposed to, I mean, because they had been building that on TV for a long time.

01:10:23.575 --> 01:10:28.218
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, apparently they just never conferred with the state athletic commission.

01:10:28.238 --> 01:10:30.439
[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, yeah, we're going to have a woman wrestle man.

01:10:30.499 --> 01:10:33.321
[SPEAKER_05]: And yeah, like day off there, I know you're not.

01:10:33.481 --> 01:10:39.985
[SPEAKER_04]: So if we got the show as it was intended, we get we get Luger and Flare in a cage.

01:10:40.600 --> 01:10:46.189
[SPEAKER_04]: but we also get this diners against our innocent and very random with poly and messy also involved.

01:10:46.650 --> 01:10:50.697
[SPEAKER_04]: Does that save how much does that save the show because obviously it saves the show a little bit?

01:10:52.213 --> 01:11:00.096
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, yeah, because I think the whole reason this show is terrible is just because, you know, it was unprecedented losing a main event like that and having these match changes.

01:11:00.116 --> 01:11:00.416
[SPEAKER_05]: You're right.

01:11:00.496 --> 01:11:01.636
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, that's what it is.

01:11:01.656 --> 01:11:06.338
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, the match quality is not good, top to bottom, but yeah, it would be much better.

01:11:06.358 --> 01:11:12.380
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, anyone WCW was kind of running on fumes, like you mentioned earlier until they went to the dangerous alliance at the end.

01:11:13.100 --> 01:11:15.821
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, I mean, it wouldn't be what it's known as now.

01:11:15.861 --> 01:11:20.683
[SPEAKER_05]: I think it's just the behind-the-scenes folly that gives that show as much deserve reputation.

01:11:22.628 --> 01:11:45.151
[SPEAKER_00]: Justin couldn't handle anymore talk about ninety one great american bash he just got up out of his chair and left he's gone not first I think he had to put his kid down for his now but uh... let's move ahead of ninety two now this one we talked i believe we talked about the match that think is going to come up about three years ago because we did a show looking back at the career of eighter

01:11:46.071 --> 01:11:46.731
[SPEAKER_00]: when he passed.

01:11:46.791 --> 01:11:51.673
[SPEAKER_00]: I think it was in June of, in the, and that check our archives if you didn't hear it, that one turned out really good.

01:11:51.693 --> 01:11:52.713
[SPEAKER_00]: I like that part a lot.

01:11:53.533 --> 01:11:56.814
[SPEAKER_00]: So I'm guessing sting invaders probably on everyone's list.

01:11:57.634 --> 01:11:58.714
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, it is, it is.

01:11:59.094 --> 01:12:01.375
[SPEAKER_04]: And I know we've been talking about these all of all day.

01:12:01.395 --> 01:12:13.698
[SPEAKER_04]: I have that poster, nationally and two posters signed by, you know, as many guys haven't met Liger yet, but as many guys who are still living as possible, signed out, and that is a favorite of mine.

01:12:14.222 --> 01:12:20.570
[SPEAKER_04]: It's such a strange show for the time period, but it's absolutely one of my nostalgic favorites.

01:12:21.910 --> 01:12:23.150
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, this was an easy pick.

01:12:23.190 --> 01:12:26.371
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, this would be in the tippy top among all the matches we're going to talk about today.

01:12:26.431 --> 01:12:30.692
[SPEAKER_05]: Such a great rivalry that these two had that span multiple years.

01:12:30.712 --> 01:12:37.373
[SPEAKER_05]: It's hard to pick a favorite paper view match of theirs between this, starcade, and then super brawl the next year.

01:12:37.393 --> 01:12:43.914
[SPEAKER_05]: A heel being put over this strong was very rare in this year.

01:12:43.934 --> 01:12:45.934
[SPEAKER_05]: And now we see it all the time, right?

01:12:45.994 --> 01:12:49.475
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, every WWE show, my god, that heel just decimates the baby face, but

01:12:50.175 --> 01:12:53.316
[SPEAKER_05]: a heel winning the title relatively clean.

01:12:53.336 --> 01:12:58.858
[SPEAKER_05]: I was pretty, I mean, staying like knocks himself out when he misses the singer splash on the post, but I mean, that was pretty clean.

01:12:59.778 --> 01:13:01.198
[SPEAKER_05]: He'll win back for nineteen ninety two.

01:13:01.298 --> 01:13:03.019
[SPEAKER_05]: So that was a big deal.

01:13:03.499 --> 01:13:04.039
[SPEAKER_05]: Um, it's funny.

01:13:04.119 --> 01:13:06.320
[SPEAKER_05]: It would grab much this being an odd show.

01:13:07.600 --> 01:13:12.821
[SPEAKER_05]: Man did like Watts just kill the energy of this promotion when he took over.

01:13:12.942 --> 01:13:14.142
[SPEAKER_05]: It just, it was so damn

01:13:15.536 --> 01:13:18.338
[SPEAKER_05]: And then they do that silly tag tournament on it.

01:13:19.398 --> 01:13:20.539
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this is the semi-main.

01:13:21.079 --> 01:13:22.760
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I mean, just watch this match.

01:13:22.820 --> 01:13:26.462
[SPEAKER_05]: I wouldn't watch the rest of that show to be honest with you.

01:13:26.482 --> 01:13:27.262
[SPEAKER_05]: It's just so dark.

01:13:28.103 --> 01:13:28.303
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:13:30.144 --> 01:13:38.228
[SPEAKER_00]: I did see in some of the reviews of this match, people were like, oh, it kind of deflates the crowd because the heel went over and everything, but I mean, that doesn't bother me watching it now.

01:13:38.248 --> 01:13:39.729
[SPEAKER_04]: People like heels going over.

01:13:39.809 --> 01:13:40.930
[SPEAKER_04]: You go home right now.

01:13:41.050 --> 01:13:41.730
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, no kidding.

01:13:42.871 --> 01:13:44.772
[SPEAKER_00]: Watch the world wrestling federation today.

01:13:45.695 --> 01:13:47.583
[SPEAKER_00]: No, I loved it.

01:13:48.486 --> 01:13:49.671
[SPEAKER_00]: I picked this up at the store.

01:13:49.691 --> 01:13:50.876
[SPEAKER_00]: I was wondering what you'd do.

01:13:52.293 --> 01:13:57.054
[SPEAKER_00]: The vintage Vader figure with the helmet, you know, with the steam and everything.

01:13:57.094 --> 01:13:58.114
[SPEAKER_00]: God, I love that era.

01:13:58.535 --> 01:14:00.175
[SPEAKER_00]: Vader's just good good stuff.

01:14:00.315 --> 01:14:02.135
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, this is this is a great one.

01:14:02.155 --> 01:14:10.398
[SPEAKER_00]: This was when I started making my list or if I was going to make a list from scratch that didn't include Kyle's recommendations is sort of in right up there.

01:14:10.418 --> 01:14:12.978
[SPEAKER_00]: One of the first ones I thought of this and and fucking flyers.

01:14:13.078 --> 01:14:13.618
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a good one.

01:14:13.778 --> 01:14:18.620
[SPEAKER_00]: So yeah, sting and sting and Vader's one of the great feuds from that era for sure.

01:14:18.640 --> 01:14:19.840
[SPEAKER_00]: Now,

01:14:20.724 --> 01:14:24.606
[SPEAKER_00]: They didn't have a great American bash at ninety three or ninety four.

01:14:25.086 --> 01:14:27.487
[SPEAKER_00]: Is there any background behind why they dropped it?

01:14:27.527 --> 01:14:28.227
[SPEAKER_00]: Does anybody know?

01:14:28.247 --> 01:14:33.969
[SPEAKER_04]: I think it's basically Eric Bischoff taking over and just clean slate.

01:14:35.090 --> 01:14:37.031
[SPEAKER_04]: You know, that's the dusty era.

01:14:37.551 --> 01:14:39.992
[SPEAKER_04]: That's, you know, the obviously last year was Bill Watts.

01:14:41.152 --> 01:14:42.133
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to do our own thing.

01:14:42.473 --> 01:14:45.354
[SPEAKER_04]: And one thing he was big on is cost cutting.

01:14:46.534 --> 01:14:47.935
[SPEAKER_04]: No more tours, obviously.

01:14:48.368 --> 01:14:54.227
[SPEAKER_04]: or no more big promoted tours, a lot more television and a lot fewer house shows.

01:14:56.249 --> 01:15:00.771
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I was thinking the same that, you know, it kind of coincides with Bischoff's rise to power.

01:15:00.871 --> 01:15:04.753
[SPEAKER_05]: Also, Ryan, if you remember, we just did that Russell Ward ninety-two pod.

01:15:05.033 --> 01:15:15.677
[SPEAKER_05]: And remember when we were talking about how many shows they had lined up and such a short span, they had Russell Ward, they did the bash, obviously that year, they had a clash, and then they did beach blast.

01:15:16.558 --> 01:15:20.580
[SPEAKER_05]: And it was like, so tight, I think it was a case where it's like, well, we've gotta get rid of something.

01:15:21.280 --> 01:15:23.181
[SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, under Eric,

01:15:24.422 --> 01:15:28.608
[SPEAKER_05]: Beach Flash, you know, Bash, the beach became a bigger deal than the Great American Bash.

01:15:28.629 --> 01:15:30.291
[SPEAKER_05]: That was kind of his baby.

01:15:30.932 --> 01:15:32.595
[SPEAKER_05]: And so, yeah, I think that's why they caught it.

01:15:32.635 --> 01:15:37.422
[SPEAKER_05]: And then they bring it back when they, you know, we're kind of doing paper news every month because that was a pretty logical thing to do.

01:15:38.093 --> 01:15:45.159
[SPEAKER_00]: They had like a campus showdown paperview or something that they were planning, I think, for early in the fall that they dropped to in that era.

01:15:45.400 --> 01:15:47.261
[SPEAKER_00]: In ninety two, yeah, yeah.

01:15:47.341 --> 01:15:48.422
[SPEAKER_05]: They were looking at two lots.

01:15:48.803 --> 01:15:49.603
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:15:50.164 --> 01:15:52.646
[SPEAKER_00]: So we get to ninety five.

01:15:53.487 --> 01:16:00.593
[SPEAKER_00]: And the one on the list here, I really like this match, especially involving Angela Poffo, Rick Flair, Randy Savage.

01:16:01.774 --> 01:16:03.736
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe not the finish that you would be expecting.

01:16:04.236 --> 01:16:16.306
[SPEAKER_00]: going in, you know, Randy is out to avenge his father and the attack, but on father's day, on father's day, but in fact, Rick gets the victory in this match.

01:16:16.366 --> 01:16:21.970
[SPEAKER_00]: And I mean, you're talking about old rivals going back to their WWF history, of course, just a few years earlier.

01:16:22.410 --> 01:16:23.931
[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of crazy looking now.

01:16:24.172 --> 01:16:25.232
[SPEAKER_00]: Maybe it's just because we're older.

01:16:26.033 --> 01:16:30.815
[SPEAKER_00]: But it seemed like at the time that their debut, I'll be off to you did then like a long time ago.

01:16:31.395 --> 01:16:32.576
[SPEAKER_00]: It's like only three years.

01:16:33.176 --> 01:16:35.637
[SPEAKER_05]: Changing promotions does wonders.

01:16:35.737 --> 01:16:39.919
[SPEAKER_05]: People have forgotten this because we just had one big national promotion for so long.

01:16:40.159 --> 01:16:40.619
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:16:40.819 --> 01:16:41.040
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:16:41.080 --> 01:16:43.721
[SPEAKER_05]: When it happens at different promotions, like a whole new world map.

01:16:44.161 --> 01:16:44.421
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:16:44.661 --> 01:16:45.501
[SPEAKER_05]: Never happened.

01:16:46.002 --> 01:16:46.222
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:16:47.435 --> 01:17:02.303
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, so you look at this match and you think about how, you know, Vince thought Randy's wrestling was behind him and wanted him to have an ounce full time and, you know, he's on a mission to show that he can still work and he's out there with Rick Flair who at this point is forty six years old and still doing top level stuff.

01:17:02.984 --> 01:17:03.744
[SPEAKER_00]: Great, great match.

01:17:03.944 --> 01:17:17.232
[SPEAKER_04]: Actually, if I was going to look at the whole show, I didn't pick anything from ninety five, but if I was going to look at the whole show, I'd probably go with Pillman and Alex Wright, even though, like I'm a long time Pillman guy, even though they always beat him.

01:17:18.398 --> 01:17:19.360
[SPEAKER_04]: They always be them.

01:17:19.580 --> 01:17:21.224
[SPEAKER_04]: And he's not going to get some push.

01:17:21.284 --> 01:17:22.366
[SPEAKER_04]: This is going to be the moment.

01:17:22.607 --> 01:17:23.088
[SPEAKER_04]: They beat him.

01:17:24.071 --> 01:17:25.191
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:17:26.072 --> 01:17:30.254
[SPEAKER_05]: That was when he first started showing the heel tendencies that he would, when he obviously turned horse with that match.

01:17:30.274 --> 01:17:34.835
[SPEAKER_05]: Like he was like, um, and he did it with like the Johnny B Bad match, too, later in the year.

01:17:34.875 --> 01:17:36.296
[SPEAKER_05]: Pillman had a kind of a nice little run.

01:17:36.336 --> 01:17:37.196
[SPEAKER_05]: That is a fun match.

01:17:37.296 --> 01:17:38.077
[SPEAKER_05]: Him and Alex, right?

01:17:38.377 --> 01:17:40.338
[SPEAKER_05]: He's like a salty baby, baby face.

01:17:40.718 --> 01:17:40.998
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:17:41.058 --> 01:17:41.238
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:17:41.278 --> 01:17:47.080
[SPEAKER_05]: He's just like, it's going, and you know, it was funny, too, because the die hards that did not like Alex, right?

01:17:47.100 --> 01:17:48.181
[SPEAKER_05]: It's baby face push it off.

01:17:48.501 --> 01:17:49.541
[SPEAKER_05]: That's one of the problems.

01:17:49.561 --> 01:17:51.702
[SPEAKER_04]: That's, that's Pillman's backyard.

01:17:52.143 --> 01:17:52.383
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:17:53.823 --> 01:17:57.286
[SPEAKER_04]: One more reason for the crowd to do Alex right into your here.

01:17:57.766 --> 01:17:58.987
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes, this was indeed.

01:17:59.648 --> 01:18:08.816
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, just down the seventy one there for me and, you know, or as they call it in King of the Riggedy three, the Heartland of America, we've heard of it as they know how it is.

01:18:08.956 --> 01:18:12.198
[SPEAKER_05]: Only the Heartland of America, we're not going to venture to city.

01:18:12.259 --> 01:18:16.262
[SPEAKER_05]: It's just, you know, right, you kind of touched on this a little bit with the Savage Flair match.

01:18:18.003 --> 01:18:19.764
[SPEAKER_05]: and comparing it to Mania eight.

01:18:20.444 --> 01:18:21.704
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not as good as Mania eight.

01:18:21.784 --> 01:18:26.486
[SPEAKER_05]: Sorry, PWM, message board, sometimes they go a little strong over-hyping things, but that's okay.

01:18:26.506 --> 01:18:27.646
[SPEAKER_05]: We all have our favorites.

01:18:28.667 --> 01:18:34.049
[SPEAKER_05]: This is kind of similar to Mania eight, just with Angela Hoffall in place of Elizabeth, right?

01:18:34.169 --> 01:18:39.690
[SPEAKER_05]: It's savage, avenging someone in the family and the other differences, Rick Flair wins here.

01:18:41.351 --> 01:18:49.498
[SPEAKER_05]: This probably is the only good thing from the first six months of the WSW, which is a wretched promotion.

01:18:49.778 --> 01:18:56.164
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, we talked about ninety-one earlier, the first six months of ninety-five, give ninety-one a run for its money.

01:18:56.584 --> 01:19:00.407
[SPEAKER_05]: Ooh, it is just the Hogan Love and Baby, and if you don't like Hulk Hogan,

01:19:01.288 --> 01:19:05.250
[SPEAKER_05]: do not watch the first six months of nineteen ninety five wcw.

01:19:05.831 --> 01:19:06.371
[SPEAKER_05]: Seconded.

01:19:06.931 --> 01:19:12.415
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Justin we're done talking about the the ninety one bash so you are safe to return here.

01:19:14.616 --> 01:19:18.738
[SPEAKER_00]: I'm in a joke on the air that Justin has had it with his discussion of ninety one.

01:19:18.818 --> 01:19:22.080
[SPEAKER_00]: He's left got up out of his chair and he loved.

01:19:22.100 --> 01:19:26.383
[SPEAKER_00]: Justin anything from ninety five bash that you wanted to discuss did you have flare savage down?

01:19:27.544 --> 01:19:33.749
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I'm assuming you guys already talked about the renegade versus our names.

01:19:34.750 --> 01:19:40.375
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, as I mentioned, the first six months of it.

01:19:40.835 --> 01:19:45.019
[SPEAKER_00]: The intro that show has the retagated and it's something like the retagade's on fire.

01:19:45.579 --> 01:19:45.940
[SPEAKER_00]: Really?

01:19:45.960 --> 01:19:46.840
[SPEAKER_00]: Really?

01:19:48.828 --> 01:19:53.034
[SPEAKER_05]: Graham correct if I'm wrong was he not tight for his debut as the ultimate surprise.

01:19:53.655 --> 01:19:56.179
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, and that was my bought on censored.

01:19:57.902 --> 01:20:01.908
[SPEAKER_04]: I was I was first years old going, wow, they're bringing warrior cool.

01:20:04.388 --> 01:20:05.749
[SPEAKER_05]: The ultimate surprise.

01:20:06.109 --> 01:20:08.269
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, they're had to be a lawsuit, right?

01:20:09.989 --> 01:20:10.329
[SPEAKER_05]: It's not.

01:20:10.389 --> 01:20:15.890
[SPEAKER_05]: It has the statute of limitations gone by because I might just break one.

01:20:15.910 --> 01:20:21.311
[SPEAKER_00]: What he's not telling you is Graham spent the next about eighteen months sin and letters that land are looking for a refund of that paper.

01:20:21.371 --> 01:20:21.591
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

01:20:22.071 --> 01:20:28.353
[SPEAKER_04]: I remember being on the school bus the next day talking to another kid who wore the paper view and I'm talking to him.

01:20:29.053 --> 01:20:30.573
[SPEAKER_04]: I don't think that was warrior.

01:20:36.457 --> 01:20:38.279
[SPEAKER_05]: There is a second ultimate warrior after all.

01:20:40.601 --> 01:20:42.042
[SPEAKER_00]: Let's look forward to ninety six.

01:20:42.643 --> 01:20:44.905
[SPEAKER_00]: Because ninety six is a damn good show.

01:20:45.085 --> 01:20:49.649
[SPEAKER_00]: I mentioned that we just did the top of nation classics on ECW one night stand.

01:20:50.250 --> 01:20:51.231
[SPEAKER_00]: Two thousand and six.

01:20:51.791 --> 01:20:55.275
[SPEAKER_00]: Number two, the show that we almost did was great American bash ninety six.

01:20:55.875 --> 01:20:58.576
[SPEAKER_00]: Behind the scenes, we were kind of hoping that was going to win the poll.

01:20:58.796 --> 01:20:59.477
[SPEAKER_00]: It did not.

01:20:59.597 --> 01:21:00.277
[SPEAKER_00]: We go.

01:21:00.317 --> 01:21:01.797
[SPEAKER_00]: We love you vote.

01:21:01.998 --> 01:21:03.398
[SPEAKER_00]: We go with what the patrons choose.

01:21:03.458 --> 01:21:05.219
[SPEAKER_00]: Patrons vote for ECW one night stamp.

01:21:05.239 --> 01:21:08.100
[SPEAKER_00]: But in the future, we will probably cover this show.

01:21:08.780 --> 01:21:17.284
[SPEAKER_00]: And on it, you get the WCW debut of Ray Mysterio taken on Dean Malenko for the Cruiserweight Championship.

01:21:17.824 --> 01:21:21.265
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, just a, you know, a showcase showing that the business is changing.

01:21:21.565 --> 01:21:28.008
[SPEAKER_00]: This is how WCW was setting themselves apart from the WWF, you know, as everybody knows when they brought in the cruiser rates.

01:21:28.088 --> 01:21:29.968
[SPEAKER_00]: And this is a phenomenal match.

01:21:30.268 --> 01:21:32.929
[SPEAKER_00]: You know, you might think that Mysterio coming in with some hype.

01:21:32.969 --> 01:21:34.070
[SPEAKER_00]: They want to put title on them.

01:21:34.110 --> 01:21:34.470
[SPEAKER_00]: They don't.

01:21:34.530 --> 01:21:35.450
[SPEAKER_00]: He loses the match.

01:21:36.110 --> 01:21:38.251
[SPEAKER_00]: But it is a spectacular one.

01:21:38.311 --> 01:21:39.311
[SPEAKER_00]: So this is on my list.

01:21:39.651 --> 01:21:40.352
[SPEAKER_00]: Anyone else have this?

01:21:41.332 --> 01:21:41.573
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:21:41.713 --> 01:21:42.013
[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, yeah.

01:21:42.093 --> 01:21:42.875
[SPEAKER_00]: Love this match.

01:21:43.756 --> 01:21:45.098
[SPEAKER_00]: I remember on the horn probably.

01:21:45.118 --> 01:21:45.459
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

01:21:45.479 --> 01:21:51.508
[SPEAKER_04]: I really know I did not have this match, but I do have another match from the show and it was a coin.

01:21:52.451 --> 01:21:53.852
[SPEAKER_01]: John Tenta Bigbubber Rogers.

01:21:54.913 --> 01:21:55.153
[UNKNOWN]: Yes.

01:21:56.575 --> 01:21:59.737
[SPEAKER_05]: I'll just say, you know, I think the most famous thing about this match.

01:21:59.757 --> 01:22:07.725
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm interested to know, I, because I have two matches from this show, so maybe guessing that Graham and I are earned a group in on the second one, there's a lot you can pick.

01:22:07.745 --> 01:22:10.867
[SPEAKER_05]: This is, you know, eighty nine and ninety six.

01:22:11.788 --> 01:22:15.852
[SPEAKER_05]: are just like the two standouts from the entire run of the bash paper view wise.

01:22:15.872 --> 01:22:18.354
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, just, um, eighty-nine's the best of that era.

01:22:18.414 --> 01:22:20.657
[SPEAKER_05]: And this is one of the best fish off your own shows forever.

01:22:20.697 --> 01:22:23.099
[SPEAKER_05]: You get the debut of the NWL, of course.

01:22:23.199 --> 01:22:28.464
[SPEAKER_05]: But I think the interesting thing behind goes on behind the scenes with Dean and Ray here.

01:22:28.484 --> 01:22:28.524
[SPEAKER_05]: So,

01:22:29.545 --> 01:22:33.511
[SPEAKER_05]: You guys have probably heard this story, but it bears repeating for anyone who may not have heard it.

01:22:34.392 --> 01:22:36.235
[SPEAKER_05]: Ray shows up in the locker room.

01:22:36.415 --> 01:22:37.357
[SPEAKER_05]: This is his debut.

01:22:37.817 --> 01:22:39.119
[SPEAKER_05]: And people in the locker and laughed at him.

01:22:39.480 --> 01:22:44.026
[SPEAKER_05]: They're like, you're putting this person on paper.

01:22:44.066 --> 01:22:44.888
[SPEAKER_05]: He's so small.

01:22:46.514 --> 01:22:48.577
[SPEAKER_05]: and nobody was laughing after the match.

01:22:48.637 --> 01:22:52.482
[SPEAKER_05]: They were all like, you know, trying to run a line, be the first to kiss his ass when he came back.

01:22:52.722 --> 01:22:53.704
[SPEAKER_05]: We've finished WCW.

01:22:53.944 --> 01:22:59.111
[SPEAKER_05]: So that's like a fascinating thing that like people like who you're putting this child on paper view.

01:22:59.572 --> 01:23:01.294
[SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, he went out there and killed it.

01:23:02.235 --> 01:23:04.997
[SPEAKER_05]: The first couple high spots, he hits in this match.

01:23:05.137 --> 01:23:07.740
[SPEAKER_05]: The announcers have no idea what they just seen.

01:23:08.020 --> 01:23:09.561
[SPEAKER_05]: Look, God, thank God Mike today.

01:23:09.601 --> 01:23:10.482
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, there's no idea.

01:23:10.502 --> 01:23:15.986
[SPEAKER_05]: Because Tony and Dusty, who Dusty kills me this whole paper view, I mean, they would have been lost without today.

01:23:16.507 --> 01:23:18.649
[SPEAKER_05]: But just a great match in a great feud.

01:23:18.669 --> 01:23:20.290
[SPEAKER_05]: You mentioned Ray does not win his debut.

01:23:20.590 --> 01:23:22.692
[SPEAKER_05]: He does eventually win the Cruiserweight title.

01:23:22.972 --> 01:23:23.693
[SPEAKER_05]: I think about a month.

01:23:23.733 --> 01:23:26.175
[SPEAKER_05]: I think they want he wins the night after Bash the beach.

01:23:27.356 --> 01:23:29.418
[SPEAKER_05]: And then my favorite match in there is actually the one to have it.

01:23:30.470 --> 01:23:48.895
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, it's a great five match series in ninety six that gets both guys over Dean Malenco in nineteen ninety six got organically over as a baby face by the end of the year Give me ninety six wc wc wc prize at least people you know who want to wear let me in shorts

01:23:52.416 --> 01:24:21.037
[SPEAKER_00]: now this is uh... at this point uh... hurricane rana had not made the lexicon of tony shivani everything's a frankinciner in this match but uh... yet today's out there to help kind of paint the story and does a good job and yeah it's a it's phenomenal and they give them a lot of time to the matches about eighteen minutes long i think it's like the second longest yet the second longest match on the show only behind flare and iron against uh... the NFLers Kevin Green and steve michael so yeah well and you know too we should hit on that real quick as we mentioned

01:24:21.777 --> 01:24:24.818
[SPEAKER_05]: Midcard match is not going long, not overstaying, they're welcome back in the day.

01:24:25.138 --> 01:24:33.800
[SPEAKER_05]: What was so unique, and obviously we all know this, and I think most people listening to this, you know, this year of WCB, the main advantage couldn't go very long.

01:24:34.400 --> 01:24:45.462
[SPEAKER_05]: But the cool thing was you had the great workers underneath, and they did, and that's dynamic work really well, actually, just giving the undercard guys more time, and then, you know, people were happy with what they got out of the main events, sometimes.

01:24:46.382 --> 01:24:50.363
[SPEAKER_00]: Graham, did you have a false, a certain false count anywhere match from the show on your list?

01:24:50.775 --> 01:24:51.715
[SPEAKER_04]: You know I did.

01:24:51.735 --> 01:24:51.796
[SPEAKER_04]: Yes.

01:24:53.256 --> 01:24:57.398
[SPEAKER_04]: So I remember I really wanted to wear this paper view.

01:24:59.159 --> 01:25:03.081
[SPEAKER_04]: My family goes up and we were in, we were in Panama City floor at the time.

01:25:03.441 --> 01:25:09.264
[SPEAKER_04]: We drive up to North Carolina because we're going to stay in a little cabin, a little lot of cabin for a week.

01:25:09.644 --> 01:25:11.525
[SPEAKER_04]: Do you know what little lot of cabins don't have?

01:25:11.885 --> 01:25:14.526
[SPEAKER_04]: They don't have cable and they don't have paper view.

01:25:15.166 --> 01:25:18.348
[SPEAKER_04]: But because we are in North Carolina,

01:25:19.274 --> 01:25:22.036
[SPEAKER_04]: The night of the paper view, the paper view is over.

01:25:22.776 --> 01:25:26.398
[SPEAKER_04]: The local news, because Kevin Green was a Carolina Panther.

01:25:26.899 --> 01:25:29.860
[SPEAKER_04]: The local news had highlights from the match.

01:25:30.301 --> 01:25:30.721
[SPEAKER_02]: Wow.

01:25:30.921 --> 01:25:31.201
[SPEAKER_04]: Wow.

01:25:31.541 --> 01:25:33.943
[SPEAKER_04]: So I was already sucked in from the build.

01:25:34.944 --> 01:25:38.966
[SPEAKER_04]: And then I remember watching, oh my god, it's big enough and it made the local news here.

01:25:39.046 --> 01:25:39.646
[SPEAKER_04]: Oh my gosh.

01:25:40.187 --> 01:25:45.410
[SPEAKER_04]: And then watching nitro, I think the next nine, or the next week, whatever it was,

01:25:46.290 --> 01:25:49.591
[SPEAKER_04]: Everyone's talking about the falls count in New Year match.

01:25:50.152 --> 01:25:53.233
[SPEAKER_04]: Everyone's talking about Ray Mysterio, Dean Malenko.

01:25:53.793 --> 01:25:58.255
[SPEAKER_04]: Everyone's talking about the end of the, not end of the other, the outsiders.

01:25:58.795 --> 01:26:02.377
[SPEAKER_04]: There were so many huge talking points coming out of their show.

01:26:02.797 --> 01:26:04.718
[SPEAKER_04]: And I remember this was so rare at the time.

01:26:05.478 --> 01:26:12.701
[SPEAKER_04]: They made an ad a commercial that you could order the VHS for only twenty dollars.

01:26:14.722 --> 01:26:15.662
[SPEAKER_04]: I did that immediately.

01:26:16.410 --> 01:26:23.153
[SPEAKER_04]: Just because if you look at the first six months of nine, ninety six and WCW, it's almost like a before and after.

01:26:23.913 --> 01:26:30.956
[SPEAKER_04]: So if you ever talk about WCW, there's WCW before Hulk Hogan and there's WCW after Hulk Hogan.

01:26:31.316 --> 01:26:37.118
[SPEAKER_04]: In nineteen, nine, six, there's WCW before the greener commission and there's a nine, WCW after the greener commission.

01:26:37.479 --> 01:26:45.742
[SPEAKER_04]: So this show gets the ball rolling for everything that comes after the cruiser weights, the NWO

01:26:46.597 --> 01:26:56.304
[SPEAKER_04]: Um, you know, the bin was solving the ECW type of violence that was starting to come in, everything starts on that night, even the reformation of the horsemen.

01:26:57.305 --> 01:26:58.926
[SPEAKER_04]: So many huge things coming out of it.

01:26:59.745 --> 01:27:02.607
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'm going to say it full disclosure.

01:27:03.067 --> 01:27:06.010
[SPEAKER_05]: I love Rick Flair and our neighbors Kevin Greed and Monko on the show.

01:27:06.170 --> 01:27:10.373
[SPEAKER_05]: Like I mean, I like with the follow up angle with Monko being like, I mean, you're a Chicago bear guy.

01:27:10.413 --> 01:27:12.194
[SPEAKER_05]: You had to love number, seventy six.

01:27:12.554 --> 01:27:12.855
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, man.

01:27:12.895 --> 01:27:13.255
[SPEAKER_00]: I love.

01:27:13.315 --> 01:27:14.576
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, wrestling.

01:27:14.596 --> 01:27:14.936
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:27:15.296 --> 01:27:17.698
[SPEAKER_05]: But I mean, Kevin Greed was a real match.

01:27:17.718 --> 01:27:19.279
[SPEAKER_05]: Well, I know other people have said it before.

01:27:20.280 --> 01:27:24.464
[SPEAKER_05]: There's a spot early in that match where, you know, obviously, Rick and R are two and a more decorate rest.

01:27:24.484 --> 01:27:25.345
[SPEAKER_05]: So, look at that, wrestle them.

01:27:25.685 --> 01:27:33.693
[SPEAKER_05]: But then green reverts to his football, and like starts doing these shoulder tackles on him, and like the crowd is so into it, that is good stuff, man.

01:27:34.134 --> 01:27:36.516
[SPEAKER_05]: That is really, really good stuff.

01:27:36.556 --> 01:27:37.877
[SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, with the false count anywhere,

01:27:38.952 --> 01:27:41.953
[SPEAKER_05]: It's such a novel brawl at the time.

01:27:42.754 --> 01:27:52.798
[SPEAKER_05]: If you weren't watching ECW, you did not see stuff like that really in nineteen ninety-six, you know, the brawling into the crowd, into the bathroom.

01:27:52.998 --> 01:27:54.639
[SPEAKER_05]: There's a woman in the men's room.

01:27:54.739 --> 01:27:56.539
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, that will never not be funny.

01:27:58.040 --> 01:28:01.002
[SPEAKER_04]: But they go on to get that summer leaf baby.

01:28:01.382 --> 01:28:02.162
[SPEAKER_03]: I guess he is.

01:28:02.483 --> 01:28:05.164
[SPEAKER_05]: He just cannot stop making toilet jokes, yes.

01:28:06.765 --> 01:28:07.986
[SPEAKER_05]: That is such a great live.

01:28:09.506 --> 01:28:13.369
[SPEAKER_05]: And Ben Watwin's actually, my God, Chris, but what a WCW paper.

01:28:13.389 --> 01:28:15.910
[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, that's certainly, you know, that's something that I do.

01:28:15.950 --> 01:28:17.171
[SPEAKER_05]: It's going to rejoice about now.

01:28:17.491 --> 01:28:18.151
[SPEAKER_04]: But at the time.

01:28:18.431 --> 01:28:22.013
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, against the guy who had been feuding with Hulkel in for the longest time.

01:28:22.134 --> 01:28:23.835
[SPEAKER_04]: That was a big shock to me, too.

01:28:23.935 --> 01:28:26.336
[SPEAKER_04]: He got owned and that really

01:28:26.937 --> 01:28:30.808
[SPEAKER_04]: If I wasn't already a huge Ben Wall fan, that was the moment.

01:28:32.453 --> 01:28:48.397
[SPEAKER_05]: And that angle afterwards, if anyone's unclear and is watching this, it wasn't watching time when Aaron comes out and people are like unclear if Aaron's gonna help the fellow, they were doing this weird horse with storyline where they were falling apart and then they just kind of jumped it when, you know, did the promotion really got going.

01:28:48.737 --> 01:28:54.338
[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, and then the pop when Aaron like reaffirms that he's on bed was like, it's just so awesome man.

01:28:54.378 --> 01:28:58.219
[SPEAKER_05]: And I mean, once Kevin Sullivan and Baltimore X below.

01:28:58.399 --> 01:29:01.600
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think that's what's been country so is the perfect place to do it.

01:29:02.820 --> 01:29:04.522
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, excellent.

01:29:04.682 --> 01:29:05.503
[SPEAKER_00]: Good good stuff.

01:29:05.743 --> 01:29:07.544
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, ninety six bashes in all time.

01:29:08.265 --> 01:29:13.469
[SPEAKER_00]: Now when we get to the later years of the great American bash, I mean, post ninety eight.

01:29:13.570 --> 01:29:15.551
[SPEAKER_00]: I have nothing on my list.

01:29:15.631 --> 01:29:16.132
[SPEAKER_00]: I went through.

01:29:16.152 --> 01:29:18.554
[SPEAKER_00]: I didn't have a lot of memories of watching those shows.

01:29:18.934 --> 01:29:22.777
[SPEAKER_00]: I did at the time, and I think I forgot a lot of it for a good reason, but

01:29:23.518 --> 01:29:34.471
[SPEAKER_00]: And when I went back to those cards, I'm like, yeah, ninety nine and nothing's going to nothing's going to make the list here, but ninety seven ninety eight, couple of things stood out, Kyle, let me just throw it to you.

01:29:34.491 --> 01:29:36.633
[SPEAKER_00]: What do you got from ninety seven and ninety eight?

01:29:37.374 --> 01:29:39.296
[SPEAKER_05]: I have nothing from ninety seven.

01:29:40.657 --> 01:29:44.979
[SPEAKER_05]: There's some good stuff on there, but nothing that really stood out like the Dallas Page Randy Savage.

01:29:45.019 --> 01:29:48.000
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, good, but again, I don't think it's my favorite of theirs.

01:29:48.061 --> 01:29:51.322
[SPEAKER_05]: I think I like spring stay and peed better if you put a gun to my head.

01:29:52.442 --> 01:30:02.267
[SPEAKER_05]: But from ninety eight, obviously one of the more remembered things of that era was the best of seven or eight with Ben Wat and Booker and

01:30:03.510 --> 01:30:04.530
[SPEAKER_05]: That's a really good match.

01:30:04.550 --> 01:30:06.051
[SPEAKER_05]: This is the final match Booker wins.

01:30:06.131 --> 01:30:11.652
[SPEAKER_05]: And what kind of stinks, you know, there's a lot of things that stink when you watch bed well matches now.

01:30:11.712 --> 01:30:22.875
[SPEAKER_05]: But one that's a little lower down is this was the period where WCW began getting very frustrating in that you had midcard guys who were clearly ready to break out of the pack.

01:30:23.155 --> 01:30:26.196
[SPEAKER_05]: These two included and they were not rewarded.

01:30:26.256 --> 01:30:32.338
[SPEAKER_05]: This was actually the first WCW paper view I did not watch live.

01:30:33.665 --> 01:30:35.145
[SPEAKER_05]: in like over a year and a half.

01:30:35.866 --> 01:30:39.167
[SPEAKER_05]: So if anyone thinks, oh my god, do you order all his paper views?

01:30:39.187 --> 01:30:42.167
[SPEAKER_05]: You had so much money down with my buddy at a scrambler, and we watched them all legally.

01:30:42.527 --> 01:30:45.048
[SPEAKER_05]: But I think the substantial limitations passed on that.

01:30:45.328 --> 01:30:49.889
[SPEAKER_05]: But yeah, I remember this was the first that we're like, you know, guys, we're not going to get together for this one.

01:30:50.690 --> 01:30:56.911
[SPEAKER_05]: And you know, watch the match many times, subsequently, and yeah, Ben Juan Booker, they killed the opener.

01:30:57.451 --> 01:30:58.472
[SPEAKER_05]: And the rest of the paper view stinks.

01:30:59.112 --> 01:30:59.292
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:31:00.416 --> 01:31:12.379
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and I think it's a weird show because in the main event, you've got Brett Hart tagging with Hulk Hogan when they were doing that weird as bread in the NWO is he not kind of thing.

01:31:12.599 --> 01:31:21.942
[SPEAKER_00]: Like he had been involved with Ben Wa and bookers series where he offered Ben Wa, like a shot with the NWO, it seemed like he did want to take their help

01:31:23.362 --> 01:31:27.143
[SPEAKER_00]: If you watch that main event and you watch Brett Hart come out next to Hulk Hogan.

01:31:27.363 --> 01:31:30.824
[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, Graham, he grew up a big Brett Hart fan like I did and like Justin did.

01:31:31.484 --> 01:31:34.265
[SPEAKER_00]: He looks like he wants to be anywhere but this.

01:31:35.025 --> 01:31:37.506
[SPEAKER_04]: And also to put in some contacts here.

01:31:37.546 --> 01:31:41.026
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, this is this is what nine months after Montreal.

01:31:41.286 --> 01:31:42.247
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

01:31:42.487 --> 01:31:47.928
[SPEAKER_04]: And to go to match upon him coming in to WCW is him versus Hogan.

01:31:48.833 --> 01:31:51.314
[SPEAKER_04]: And now they're tagging so he's already dead in the water.

01:31:51.955 --> 01:31:54.236
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, he's he's already like just another guy.

01:31:54.856 --> 01:31:59.679
[SPEAKER_00]: Luckily, Michael Buffer gets the introduction right on the show and does call him Brett Hart not Brett Clark.

01:31:59.779 --> 01:32:00.839
[SPEAKER_00]: So that was a win.

01:32:00.859 --> 01:32:04.261
[SPEAKER_05]: That was such a big internet thing at night being ever.

01:32:04.641 --> 01:32:07.463
[SPEAKER_05]: Everybody would always make Brett Clark jokes after that.

01:32:07.483 --> 01:32:07.603
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

01:32:08.323 --> 01:32:13.446
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, Bretton, Bretton, Hogan against Roddy Piper and Randy Savage.

01:32:13.786 --> 01:32:20.070
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, I mean, to think where Brett was a year earlier, and then when you watch him in this match, you're like, geez, what are they doing?

01:32:20.130 --> 01:32:21.591
[SPEAKER_00]: And what a wasted opportunity.

01:32:21.671 --> 01:32:24.833
[SPEAKER_00]: But Booker and Benoit, that's a good one.

01:32:25.333 --> 01:32:27.775
[SPEAKER_00]: I had written down to my notes the Savi G.P.

01:32:27.815 --> 01:32:30.717
[SPEAKER_00]: match from the year prior, because I was trying to get something from ninety seven in there.

01:32:31.537 --> 01:32:33.520
[SPEAKER_00]: But then you have post-nidiate.

01:32:33.800 --> 01:32:35.042
[SPEAKER_00]: There's really nothing to speak of.

01:32:35.082 --> 01:32:37.165
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, Savage and Paige, they had a good few.

01:32:38.146 --> 01:32:45.957
[SPEAKER_00]: As Kyle mentioned, probably not their best match, but you know, if you're going through the history of the Great American Bash, ninety-seven's worth of watch with Savage and GDP, I think.

01:32:46.698 --> 01:32:49.240
[SPEAKER_05]: All of the matches are very unique on ninety seven.

01:32:49.260 --> 01:32:52.002
[SPEAKER_05]: Like you just like have no idea what match is going to happen next.

01:32:52.022 --> 01:32:55.485
[SPEAKER_05]: They like go ultimo dragons, psychosis, diners, Harlem heat.

01:32:55.505 --> 01:32:57.086
[SPEAKER_05]: There's like a frickin' women's match.

01:32:57.126 --> 01:32:58.447
[SPEAKER_05]: I think glacier and mortis.

01:32:58.747 --> 01:32:59.728
[SPEAKER_05]: You're like my god.

01:32:59.748 --> 01:33:02.671
[SPEAKER_05]: The variety of styles in this promotion.

01:33:03.151 --> 01:33:06.994
[SPEAKER_04]: Well, you can really tell three and ninety seven that the focus is on nitro.

01:33:07.194 --> 01:33:08.835
[SPEAKER_04]: The focus is not on the paper view.

01:33:09.176 --> 01:33:13.579
[SPEAKER_04]: Like they will take your paper view money, but they really want you to watch every Monday instead.

01:33:13.599 --> 01:33:14.480
[SPEAKER_00]: Mm-hmm.

01:33:15.100 --> 01:33:15.460
[SPEAKER_00]: For sure.

01:33:15.500 --> 01:33:16.141
[SPEAKER_00]: That's a great point.

01:33:16.412 --> 01:33:19.255
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because what's the best like, in the United States to be paid for you?

01:33:21.177 --> 01:33:24.320
[SPEAKER_05]: That's not real.

01:33:25.021 --> 01:33:32.209
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, because it was like a hot promotion, but like, I'm trying to think like none of them like really stood out.

01:33:32.409 --> 01:33:34.291
[SPEAKER_04]: Helping have it, I would probably pick up.

01:33:34.311 --> 01:33:36.073
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah, because with Eddie and Ray, yeah.

01:33:36.527 --> 01:33:41.888
[SPEAKER_04]: But like the whole show is either, it's either phenomenal matches like that or super hot for you.

01:33:43.649 --> 01:33:48.790
[SPEAKER_05]: You know, you're talking about not a Brett in ninety eight at the Great American Bash.

01:33:50.210 --> 01:33:55.771
[SPEAKER_05]: Is that the show or somebody phone a that call the arena said stew heart had died?

01:33:57.352 --> 01:33:58.092
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, it might have been.

01:33:59.432 --> 01:34:00.673
[SPEAKER_00]: I forget when that happened.

01:34:01.114 --> 01:34:04.457
[SPEAKER_00]: I want to, I think that was a great American bash show, maybe.

01:34:05.258 --> 01:34:10.302
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm almost positive now that it happened because they like, this shop said like, you don't have to work the show.

01:34:10.322 --> 01:34:17.249
[SPEAKER_05]: Because when you, when you mentioned Brett, I mean, obviously Brett is not, you know, exchanging Christmas cards of the whole co-organ at this point.

01:34:18.650 --> 01:34:21.612
[SPEAKER_05]: What you mentioned how he looked that like kind of jogged a memory.

01:34:21.652 --> 01:34:27.875
[SPEAKER_05]: I'm like, I think this might have been to show or somebody phoned the arena and told to tell Brett Stewart died, which was a lie.

01:34:28.376 --> 01:34:32.238
[SPEAKER_05]: Obviously, it was a prank call, which is just a frickin' hideous thing to do.

01:34:32.578 --> 01:34:32.938
[SPEAKER_00]: It was.

01:34:33.098 --> 01:34:33.739
[SPEAKER_00]: It was a show.

01:34:33.779 --> 01:34:34.779
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I just googled it.

01:34:35.360 --> 01:34:37.821
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay, I was gonna say, because it's Brett's only bash match.

01:34:38.541 --> 01:34:38.701
[SPEAKER_00]: Yep.

01:34:39.042 --> 01:34:39.602
[SPEAKER_05]: All right.

01:34:39.622 --> 01:34:40.602
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, so that makes sense, yeah.

01:34:42.403 --> 01:34:43.164
[SPEAKER_05]: How about that?

01:34:43.384 --> 01:34:44.825
[SPEAKER_00]: So that's another reason he didn't want to be there.

01:34:44.865 --> 01:34:45.285
[SPEAKER_00]: He's Brett.

01:34:45.305 --> 01:34:45.505
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:34:45.765 --> 01:34:46.086
[SPEAKER_00]: No doubt.

01:34:47.810 --> 01:34:49.631
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I'm looking at an article right now.

01:34:50.671 --> 01:34:55.913
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Bishop and Dylan offered Brett the night off, but later Brett received confirmation.

01:34:55.953 --> 01:35:02.455
[SPEAKER_00]: So there was actually a live and well, but still shaken by the incident, the prank obviously kind of stayed with him the rest of the night.

01:35:02.555 --> 01:35:04.196
[SPEAKER_00]: So they were booking him bad.

01:35:04.236 --> 01:35:05.316
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that on top of it.

01:35:05.356 --> 01:35:08.898
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, Brett looks like he wants to be anywhere, but the great American bash that night.

01:35:10.458 --> 01:35:15.380
[SPEAKER_00]: Did you guys have any other matches on your list in the later part of the nineties that we should hit on before we wrap this up?

01:35:16.983 --> 01:35:17.724
[SPEAKER_00]: Grammar Justin?

01:35:19.845 --> 01:35:20.186
[SPEAKER_04]: No.

01:35:20.766 --> 01:35:21.487
[SPEAKER_04]: Two thousand.

01:35:22.087 --> 01:35:22.888
[SPEAKER_04]: Two thousand.

01:35:23.628 --> 01:35:32.215
[SPEAKER_04]: It's an interesting time frame because I was willing to give the new blood and the millionaire club a chance.

01:35:33.316 --> 01:35:40.362
[SPEAKER_04]: I like the concept of taking all the stylish guys and making them the the underdog saying.

01:35:40.562 --> 01:35:43.965
[SPEAKER_04]: But it just it went sideways so quickly.

01:35:45.604 --> 01:35:57.487
[SPEAKER_05]: is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is, is,

01:36:14.432 --> 01:36:15.095
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, sure.

01:36:15.115 --> 01:36:17.464
[SPEAKER_05]: He was really staying up all night thinking about that one.

01:36:17.484 --> 01:36:17.725
[SPEAKER_05]: Eric.

01:36:20.363 --> 01:36:27.908
[SPEAKER_00]: Well, hopefully we have given you guys something to go back on WWE Network if you're international or peacock and rewatch.

01:36:27.948 --> 01:36:29.770
[SPEAKER_00]: We always love doing these historical shows.

01:36:29.810 --> 01:36:40.357
[SPEAKER_00]: We love bringing on guests out of spectacular ones today with Graham Coff and hopefully we can bring Graham back in the future and it won't be five years Graham until I get you on the podcast again next time.

01:36:41.037 --> 01:36:45.981
[SPEAKER_00]: Tell the listeners where they can find you and if you've got anything in the works and wrestling wise for the future.

01:36:46.781 --> 01:36:51.524
[SPEAKER_04]: biggest the easiest place would be Twitter at the history of WWE.

01:36:51.544 --> 01:36:52.444
[SPEAKER_04]: Feel free to tweet me.

01:36:52.484 --> 01:36:53.345
[SPEAKER_04]: Ask me questions.

01:36:53.485 --> 01:36:56.967
[SPEAKER_04]: I mean, I know the answer is what I'll make something up.

01:36:56.987 --> 01:36:57.967
[SPEAKER_00]: The only way to do it, man.

01:36:58.667 --> 01:36:59.508
[SPEAKER_00]: That's how we survived.

01:37:00.288 --> 01:37:01.489
[SPEAKER_00]: Now, this was a lot of fun.

01:37:01.509 --> 01:37:04.871
[SPEAKER_00]: I really appreciate connecting with you here and getting to talk to you.

01:37:05.311 --> 01:37:05.811
[SPEAKER_00]: It's a good time.

01:37:05.831 --> 01:37:05.991
[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

01:37:06.051 --> 01:37:12.214
[SPEAKER_04]: And if I can add one thing about the bash, you know, when you look at the beginning of it and you look at the end of it, it but got it begins.

01:37:13.588 --> 01:37:17.390
[SPEAKER_04]: as a unique live experience that you're not going to find anywhere else.

01:37:18.110 --> 01:37:25.073
[SPEAKER_04]: It ends as an afterthought because we want you to watch the show from home.

01:37:26.134 --> 01:37:27.675
[SPEAKER_04]: And you can see that progression.

01:37:28.735 --> 01:37:29.836
[SPEAKER_04]: We want you to buy a ticket.

01:37:29.896 --> 01:37:30.776
[SPEAKER_04]: We want you to be there.

01:37:30.796 --> 01:37:31.877
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to have fireworks.

01:37:31.917 --> 01:37:32.937
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to have a concert.

01:37:32.957 --> 01:37:38.620
[SPEAKER_04]: We're going to have, you know, blow off to matches that you've been waiting for for months and months and months and months.

01:37:38.740 --> 01:37:41.181
[SPEAKER_04]: And it ends as just another paper view.

01:37:42.219 --> 01:37:46.783
[SPEAKER_04]: during a week in which we have, you know, fifteen hours of television to fill.

01:37:47.563 --> 01:37:49.425
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, well put, well put.

01:37:50.626 --> 01:37:52.988
[SPEAKER_00]: Justin, Kyle, any closing thoughts for you guys?

01:37:53.448 --> 01:37:57.311
[SPEAKER_01]: I'm ready to get started on part two two hours of the WWE version.

01:37:57.351 --> 01:37:57.611
[SPEAKER_01]: Let's go.

01:37:57.631 --> 01:37:58.532
[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

01:37:58.552 --> 01:37:58.893
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

01:37:58.933 --> 01:38:02.836
[SPEAKER_00]: Full of thousands of you to be a bash.

01:38:04.357 --> 01:38:04.737
[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, yeah.

01:38:04.797 --> 01:38:06.018
[SPEAKER_05]: Maybe else first title one.

01:38:06.038 --> 01:38:06.138
[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.

01:38:07.319 --> 01:38:10.301
[SPEAKER_05]: That's just, no man, I love talking all rustic.

01:38:10.321 --> 01:38:11.542
[SPEAKER_05]: Two shows in a row guys.

01:38:12.163 --> 01:38:12.963
[SPEAKER_05]: Two shows in a row.

01:38:13.003 --> 01:38:14.524
[SPEAKER_05]: Love talking about all rustic with you guys.

01:38:14.564 --> 01:38:15.245
[SPEAKER_05]: Thank you so much.

01:38:15.725 --> 01:38:16.486
[SPEAKER_05]: Grant for coming on.

01:38:16.526 --> 01:38:26.753
[SPEAKER_05]: It was great and hopefully one day we can convince Ryan that top rope nation classic can become the main thing and then we'll just brand when we talk about present rustic top rope nation present.

01:38:28.394 --> 01:38:32.997
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, yeah, we can just flip it all on attack because, man, it's just great to go down memory lane.

01:38:34.093 --> 01:39:00.005
[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, well speaking about that, I should mention that if you want to hear more current wrestling, because we have been doing these classic shows the last couple of weeks, Patreon, or if you have the Spotify Green Room app, Kyle and I will be on there next week, talking about the latest news in pro wrestling, can listen live on the Spotify Green Room app, follow myself, and Kyle, and then we post them in podcast forms as a top pro nation extra, the bonus show over on Patreon every week.

01:39:00.845 --> 01:39:10.938
[SPEAKER_00]: If you want to hear us talking about the WWE releases, for example, that just happened yesterday, I'm sure we're going to be addressing that next week and all the layers with AEW and WWE.

01:39:10.958 --> 01:39:13.341
[SPEAKER_05]: I was going to ask you, I see we're doing a Dynamite post show as well.

01:39:14.322 --> 01:39:15.103
[SPEAKER_00]: Uh, we could.

01:39:15.603 --> 01:39:15.944
[SPEAKER_00]: We could.

01:39:16.764 --> 01:39:19.286
[SPEAKER_05]: So it's fun doing the game planning live on here.

01:39:19.407 --> 01:39:20.207
[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, we can.

01:39:20.247 --> 01:39:22.529
[SPEAKER_00]: We know into the next page of the top rope nation there.

01:39:22.910 --> 01:39:24.031
[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, we'll be talking about that.

01:39:24.131 --> 01:39:27.013
[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, follow the show on Twitter at top rope nation.

01:39:27.373 --> 01:39:32.878
[SPEAKER_00]: We have a Facebook pro wrestling discussion group join that search top rope nation pro wrestling discussion.

01:39:33.258 --> 01:39:37.082
[SPEAKER_00]: You can find Kyle at TRP Kyle Justin's at Justin joint.

01:39:37.582 --> 01:39:39.544
[SPEAKER_00]: and I am at Ryan Drosty.

01:39:40.124 --> 01:39:41.885
[SPEAKER_00]: We will see you guys next time.

01:39:41.925 --> 01:39:48.650
[SPEAKER_00]: This has been episode two, thirteen of top rope nation enjoy your independent stay weekend.

01:39:48.811 --> 01:39:50.011
[SPEAKER_00]: Watch some classic wrestling.

01:39:50.392 --> 01:39:50.812
[SPEAKER_00]: Catch you next time.

01:40:12.626 --> 01:40:22.739
[SPEAKER_06]: I'll get you in this organization, that you find, and somewhere home away, you might find out who you are.

01:40:42.654 --> 01:40:43.902
[UNKNOWN]: Thank you.